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  1. #1

    Default Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    The fog is thick over Auckland this morning so no planes are landing at Mangere.

    But I remember reading about a landing system that was invented in WW2 to enable planes to land in zero visibility and so I wondered why they do not use that? And I'm certain it was called Instrument Landing System (ILS). Apparently the plane flies on a radio beam and the pilot hears a steady tone when he is on the beam, a dash, dash, dash when to one side of the beam and a dot, dot, dot when on the other side and then lights on the side of the runway on the final approach. I would think that modern day aircraft would have something akin to an auto pilot that would do that for the pilot.

    So if they had that in WW2, why can the aircraft not land in fog these days? There must be some other reason why the airport is closed. I'd be interested to know.
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  2. #2
    Senior Member 1101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Roscoe View Post

    So if they had that in WW2, why can the aircraft not land in fog these days?
    They used to have barrels of burning oil? down the runway to burn off the fog

    They did lots of things in WW2 they would never do in peacetime :-)

    Why dont they land in fog
    Air traffic control tower cant see the runway
    pilots cant see the runway
    no way of seeing if theres something on the runway that shouldnt be there , like another plane (it happens)
    Automated landing might miss the runway completely , killing everyone . If pilots cant see they cant correct .

    We are talking about risking 100++ lives
    Last edited by 1101; 07-06-2022 at 09:26 AM.

  3. #3
    Seasoned Member allblack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Roscoe View Post
    I'd be interested to know
    I answered this question here some time ago. If you're good at searching you'll find it.

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    tweakedgeek tweak'e's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Roscoe View Post
    The fog is thick over Auckland this morning so no planes are landing at Mangere.

    But I remember reading about a landing system that was invented in WW2 to enable planes to land in zero visibility and so I wondered why they do not use that? And I'm certain it was called Instrument Landing System (ILS). Apparently the plane flies on a radio beam and the pilot hears a steady tone when he is on the beam, a dash, dash, dash when to one side of the beam and a dot, dot, dot when on the other side and then lights on the side of the runway on the final approach. I would think that modern day aircraft would have something akin to an auto pilot that would do that for the pilot.

    So if they had that in WW2, why can the aircraft not land in fog these days? There must be some other reason why the airport is closed. I'd be interested to know.
    ILS only gets them most of the way, they still have to land by sight for the last little bit. there is minimum visibility levels for ILS landings.
    however modern craft/airports can have radar guided auto pilot systems which will auto land the aircraft.
    my guess is those planes don't have it or the airport is not setup for that.

    its been a big stink in USA over that because their 5g cell services was being expanded right up against the radar frequency used for the auto land system. if it causes interference, planes may crash.
    Tweak it till it breaks

  5. #5
    Seasoned Member allblack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by tweak'e View Post
    my guess is those planes don't have it or the airport is not setup for that.
    In a nutshell, that's it. There are 3 categories of ILS depending on a bit of help to we'll carry you down the whole way.

    The airport has to install the CAT level it needs for most air traffic arriving, and the aircraft has to have the corresponding software installed. Not always the case, as money dictates.

    An aircraft can have the bells and whistles version, but if the airport doesn't then it's wasted.

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    Senior Member piroska's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Auckland has instrument landing, I found this out when I came back last time, they couldn't land here cause Napier doesn't but could in Auckland.

    But maybe the bigger planes have the gear and the smaller ones don't?
    Ex-pctek

  7. #7

    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by piroska View Post
    But maybe the bigger planes have the gear and the smaller ones don't?
    I have found out since that it is, sort of, that the bigger planes have it and the small ones don't. Apparently the overseas planes have it but the local planes do not.
    It is better to wear out than to rust out.
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    Seasoned Member allblack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    True.

    If you're going to fly a large A380 12 hours around the world with 300+ customers on board, you want a reasonable assurance from the destination airport that they've spent the coin installing the tech so it can accept you if there's a bit of fog.

    But a little plane from Napier with 15 peaople on board, not so important. It can fly back.

  9. #9
    Senior Member piroska's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by allblack View Post

    But a little plane from Napier with 15 peaople on board, not so important. It can fly back.
    68
    Ex-pctek

  10. #10
    tweakedgeek tweak'e's Avatar
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    Default Re: Fog over Auckland - airport closed. Why is that?

    Quote Originally Posted by piroska View Post
    Auckland has instrument landing, I found this out when I came back last time, they couldn't land here cause Napier doesn't but could in Auckland.

    But maybe the bigger planes have the gear and the smaller ones don't?
    no, more to do with the airport. assuming where talking passenger planes. most if not all have ILS system of some sort on the planes. but common to have small airports to be visual landing only (no ILS).
    visual landing requires a longer visible distance than an ILS landing. so small airports close in bad weather while the bigger ones with ILS can stay open.
    Tweak it till it breaks

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