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  1. #61
    Bleakly Optomistic
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Druid View Post
    I have no problem with Maori retaining and using their culture and language if that is what they want to do.

    What I object to is having it foisted on me as a non-Maori. If people want to communicate in a language that is incomprehensible to the rest of the world, so be it. But I have no aspirations to do so. If I must learn another language, it will be one that has far more global relevance.

    There are two dedicated Maori TV channels which feature everything Maori for the benefit of Maori. Why does it have to be injected into supposedly English language channels when it is only understood by a tiny percentage of the population?

    'And don't get me started on the Maori naming of Government departments in that language which is not understood by the majority of New Zealanders, regardless of race. Now I have no idea which department does what.
    Yeah, let's all slam using one of our national languages. Or would it be better to revert to our third one, and have everything in sign language

  2. #62
    Ancient Member Blue Druid's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Not slamming it. Just saying that it's use should be confined to those to whom it belongs.

    And whose idea was it to make it a "National Language" anyway? I wasn't asked. Hands up anyone who was asked. I fail to understand how a language that is only understood by a small minority of the population can be called a "National Language."

    Language has only one purpose – to communicate and a language that is not understood fails to do that.

    Perhaps the next step will be to read the news in Swahili, Urdu or Arabic? And make them national languages too?

  3. #63
    Senior Member baabits's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Druid View Post
    Not slamming it. Just saying that it's use should be confined to those to whom it belongs.

    And whose idea was it to make it a "National Language" anyway? I wasn't asked. Hands up anyone who was asked. I fail to understand how a language that is only understood by a small minority of the population can be called a "National Language."

    Language has only one purpose Ė to communicate and a language that is not understood fails to do that.

    Perhaps the next step will be to read the news in Swahili, Urdu or Arabic? And make them national languages too?
    Thankfully surveys and polling have shown time and time again that more people are supportive of Maori being a national language, of compulsory study of the language in primary school and more.

    You can embrace the change or ignore it and let the world pass you by. Personally I think being bilingual is a good thing, and that thereís nothing wrong with learning more about Maori culture and language as it becomes more and more apart of Kiwiís identity and the way we distinguish ourselves on the world stage.

    If you donít want to of course you donít have to and you have a right to your own opinion. Majority rules

    All that really bugged me in this thread personally was the name Roscoe decided to give this thread, the pompous and sometimes racist attitude of some of our friends, and some pf the misinformation in the thread. The opinion about Simon was fine, even if I disagree with it.

    Edit: one more point in regards to other languages, I think youíre being absolutely disingenuous when mentioning things like Urdu or Swahili- considering the history of our country Maori culture and language has a much stronger connection to the land as opposed to any others. While English is the common language, having Maori as an official language helps with healing the wrongs of the past and recognises that for a significant number of the population, it is an issue that is important to them and we recognise that historically both European and Maori cultures have played a significant part in forming this country.
    Last edited by baabits; 30-04-2021 at 12:30 PM.

  4. #64
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Simon Dallow in particular - saying something in Maori that few people understand. Jeez Roscoe your time must be really expensive, it only takes him less than 2 seconds to say it, doesn't matter if you can understand it or not.

  5. #65
    Retired old codger kenj's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    I suppose we have to assume that nothing of importance will be said in maori?

    If something is important, it will first be read out in English as nearly everyone speaks that, then maori?

    Ken

  6. #66
    Bleakly Optomistic
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by kenj View Post
    I suppose we have to assume that nothing of importance will be said in maori?

    If something is important, it will first be read out in English as nearly everyone speaks that, then maori?

    Ken
    It is New Zealand. Not England. Why not mix the language?

  7. #67

    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by jebby View Post
    doesn't matter if you can understand it or not.
    So what's the point of it if it doesn't matter?

    Baabits: "Personally I think being bilingual is a good thing" and I have nothing against being bilingual. I, too, think it is a good thing, but if you want to be bilingual. why not study a languague that a few more people speak, such as French or German? Have you ever been to France or Germany? If you have, you will realise just how useful knowing these languagues is, particularly in France where they are not too keen on you speaking English. At least a fair proportion of the world's population speak French and German (for example) rather than the very small amount of maori speaking people.

    So I'm with you, Blue Druid, "Language has only one purpose Ė to communicate and a language that is not understood fails to do that." and it is understood by very few so it is not serving it's purpose.

    So let's have the news in the languague that everyone in the country understands. Let's all speak English and leave the maori speakers to themselves - at least those few who understand it.
    It is better to wear out than to rust out.
    - Richard Chamberlain, Tour of the Hebrides

    Us husbands are a sorry lot.

  8. #68
    Senior Member baabits's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by Roscoe View Post
    So what's the point of it if it doesn't matter?

    Baabits: "Personally I think being bilingual is a good thing" and I have nothing against being bilingual. I, too, think it is a good thing, but if you want to be bilingual. why not study a languague that a few more people speak, such as French or German? Have you ever been to France or Germany? If you have, you will realise just how useful knowing these languagues is, particularly in France where they are not too keen on you speaking English. At least a fair proportion of the world's population speak French and German (for example) rather than the very small amount of maori speaking people.

    So I'm with you, Blue Druid, "Language has only one purpose – to communicate and a language that is not understood fails to do that." and it is understood by very few so it is not serving it's purpose.

    So let's have the news in the languague that everyone in the country understands. Let's all speak English and leave the maori speakers to themselves - at least those few who understand it.
    Why? Because Maori, whether it is to you or not, is something a majority of New Zealanders support expansion of in our society. Te Puni Kokiri does surveys on this, and I'm sorry but you and your disdain for having to listen to a few words in what you obviously feel is a language beneath you (why the hell else would you call it cave man language, or uncivilized, if you were joking you're an ass and if you're not joking then you need help) is in the minority. A majority of non-Maori people surveyed support

    -"Some Māori language education should be compulsory in schools for all children" (64%)
    - believe that "The Government should encourage the use of Māori in everyday situations such as in the home or at the marae" (64%)
    - believe that "It is only right that the signage is in both Māori and English" (59%)
    - believe that "The Government’s support of Māori radio stations is a good thing (85%)

    and a bunch more.

    These are also stats that have trended upwards over time, so there's no doubt that support for the language will continue to grow.

    The news is in English. Simon literally only says a few Maori phrases and it pisses you off, so I think you're being absolutely unreasonable. My knee jerk reaction is that you're a racist hack who just doesn't want to hear Maori, but I'll give you more credit than that. Either way you're blowing what really isn't a major issue way out of proportion, and insulting those of us who it is important to while you're at it. And before you give me the whole read my post it's only about Simon crap, you can just stop right there. The title of this thread and then your further attempt to explain it say more about you as a person than you could ever justify.

  9. #69
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by baabits View Post
    Why? Because Maori, whether it is to you or not, is something a majority of New Zealanders support expansion of in our society. Te Puni Kokiri does surveys on this, and I'm sorry but you and your disdain for having to listen to a few words in what you obviously feel is a language beneath you (why the hell else would you call it cave man language, or uncivilized, if you were joking you're an ass and if you're not joking then you need help) is in the minority. A majority of non-Maori people surveyed support

    -"Some Māori language education should be compulsory in schools for all children" (64%)
    - believe that "The Government should encourage the use of Māori in everyday situations such as in the home or at the marae" (64%)
    - believe that "It is only right that the signage is in both Māori and English" (59%)
    - believe that "The Government’s support of Māori radio stations is a good thing (85%)

    and a bunch more.

    These are also stats that have trended upwards over time, so there's no doubt that support for the language will continue to grow.

    The news is in English. Simon literally only says a few Maori phrases and it pisses you off, so I think you're being absolutely unreasonable. My knee jerk reaction is that you're a racist hack who just doesn't want to hear Maori, but I'll give you more credit than that. Either way you're blowing what really isn't a major issue way out of proportion, and insulting those of us who it is important to while you're at it. And before you give me the whole read my post it's only about Simon crap, you can just stop right there. The title of this thread and then your further attempt to explain it say more about you as a person than you could ever justify.
    If you are going to make a claim that the majority are in support of anything you have to give a reference to the survey that says that including who was surveyed and by who. Otherwise it looks like you are making it up.

  10. #70
    Seasoned Member allblack's Avatar
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    Default Re: I have no use for a cave man language

    Quote Originally Posted by baabits View Post
    Why? Because Maori, whether it is to you or not, is something a majority of New Zealanders support expansion of in our society.
    Utter crap. Granted I've only lived here for 55 years, but I've never seen any evidence of that.

    However, I don't have evidence apart from residency to support my claim. What you got to support yours bro? If you live 'too far away' there's a good chance you might not know squat.

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