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  1. #1
    Wanderer
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    Default Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    I can see how without CGT it can be advantage for some people. Yes, if you develop houses or sell them quickly there is still tax on it and the same to shares as well. But for those who hold them for some years there is essentially no CGT. They obviously do pay tax on rental income and dividend income however.

    With CGT, maybe there will be less investment into NZ business from overseas, less migrants, less people spending money here, less friends and family coming over for a trip, potentially less jobs available. If there is a drop in the house prices, the mortgage might be higher than the house price. Places like Singapore and Hong Kong don't have CGT and are capital markets of the world.

    In theory, one could quit their PAYE job, put their life savings into capital and pay very minimal tax on dividend and rental income.

    Love to hear your views.

  2. #2
    Senior Member 1101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    It wouldnt be need if the TAX DEPT did their job .

    any 2nd house (excluding holiday house or house bought for parents/kids) is bought solely for profit. There is no other reason to buy a 2nd house
    if you do something for a profit , its taxable. Its that simple .Why is that so hard to enforce ?

    We dont need another law for this. Enforce what we allready have .

    A few have been caught buy the tax dept when selling 2nd houses , not many though

    Some AK'ers are now buying their 1st home with no intention of living in it . Some buying 1st house in other cities as its all they can afford , but will never live there
    Should that also be taxable (I'd say yes)

    The other thing to consider, if we keep making things harder & stricter for landlords , to the point where many will stop renting & leave the house empty, who will
    provide all the housing for all the renters .
    If we really want to help those living in cars or 2 families in a garage, do we relax all the rental laws & relax Cap Gain Taxes ? Making things harder for landlords sounds great but has real consequences .

  3. #3
    Senior Member 1101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    If we do get a CGT on houses, how is it going to work?
    Do we charge every year, a provisional tax annually ? That will put many off .

    do we wait till they sell 10 years later. If so, what about all the tax deductible expenditure on that house. Who's going to audit 10+ years of receipts/expenses ?
    Do we apply CGT to existing houses: if so who determines what the original price was & what tax deductible expenses can be applied . That will get messy .
    Can mortgage interest payments be used as a tax deduction if CGT applies ? Do we apply those deductions only in that year or wait till the house is sold & deduct them all then ?

  4. #4
    Wanderer
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    At the moment there is a 2yr but maybe the IRD would look at a 5yr with a bit of scrutiny. Now, people can say, I bought a house that I don't live in or I rent it out, my primary motive is rental income which is taxed and they pay that however, house price (capital gains) was just coincidence

  5. #5
    Apple free and happy KarameaDave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    Most countries have some sort of unearned capital gains taxation, and I see no good reason why we should differ.
    If they can do it, it can be done, so we won't need to reinvent the wheel.
    My advice is to stop panicking and take a deep breath.

    https://taxfoundation.org/capital-ga...try-2011-oecd/
    (Although, this list is outdated and does not include India or China which excludes a fair chunk of the world population.)
    FTW

  6. #6
    pcsourcepoint
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    But if a NZ'r wants to buy another home(s), it may not necessarily be for profit.They may want to live elsewhere - including abroad. Therefore, may be better to buy homes in other countries - and perhaps live in them. Plenty of UK celebrities, like Ron Wood, Jagger, Richards, etc, just buy homes around the world. Often Europe. Maybe a Holiday home within NZ be used under guise as another family living home - e.g. by renting to family members, or friends.

    I got a mate at 72, a travelling mechanic/welder who had two homes, but wisely sold them, and still works - and lived north to south in several cities. He has no tie downs, worried about potential taxes, upkeep, renters, etc, for his homes, which he rarely used. But has fat bank account to buy when he retires.

    Or buy a 2nd home for "social" housing within NZ. I see Housing NZ now added to social agencies, and more aligned with MSD (Ministry of Social Development). Just wandering if wealthy - and charitable people may have 2nd homes with the Govt. Social housing database. I think churches are, trusts, corporations, etc, and perhaps escape/reduced tax.
    Last edited by kahawai chaser; 24-08-2017 at 01:38 PM.
    Computer Tech Links (My Tutorials & Reviews)| Free MP3 Software Reviews (My Reviews)|I Student NZ (My Student Resoucre Tips)

  7. #7
    Senior Member paulw's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    I suspect a Labor CGT will also be for other assets other than second houses like when you sell a farm or business and maybe your family home. They haven't said much about their new tax grab but you can bet it will be bad..
    Regards,

    Paul W
    Taco Bell is not a Mexican telephone company

  8. #8
    Apple free and happy KarameaDave's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    Quote Originally Posted by paulw View Post
    I suspect a Labor CGT will also be for other assets other than second houses like when you sell a farm or business and maybe your family home. They haven't said much about their new tax grab but you can bet it will be bad..
    Why are you concerned about the Australian Labor Party?
    FTW

  9. #9
    Senior Member pctek's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    Other countries do it. They still have landlords and rentals.

    Good idea in my opinion, no it won't affect the family home....

    As usual, I like a few of Labours ideas, a few of nationals, then vice versa as well.
    Sigh.....so hard to decide.
    wipe your paws.

  10. #10
    Senior Member 1101's Avatar
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    Default Re: Capital gains tax comes on the radar again ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nomad View Post
    At the moment there is a 2yr but maybe the IRD would look at a 5yr with a bit of scrutiny. Now, people can say, I bought a house that I don't live in or I rent it out, my primary motive is rental income which is taxed and they pay that however, house price (capital gains) was just coincidence
    using my best bush lawyer skills ... :-)
    If they are renting it out, IRD can claim its part of their 'business'. So any gain at the end will be taxable .
    Claiming a profit wasnt intended doesnt somehow make it non taxable. Imagine the loophole that would create for all businesses
    If I do some work for someone I know to help them out for free, then they pay me for the weekends work , thats taxable .

    Why should house sales ever be any different than any other business operation ? I think that has to be the bottom line .

    Having a system of landords offering up homes for social housing, at reduced rent, in return for no CGT may be a good idea ?
    Last edited by 1101; 24-08-2017 at 03:19 PM.

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