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View Full Version : Prime Minister delivered the Crown apology to Viet Nam veterans.



lightfoot
31-05-2008, 09:36 AM
An important and historical event. Any idea where I can read about this speech and other speeches given by other parties in the house on that day.

Also, is Helen apologising on behalf of NZ or the Queen/England? Anyone knows if any other country doing the same?

Speedy Gonzales
31-05-2008, 09:38 AM
Probably on the nz herald site, or the NZ govt website

TV3 / TV1 may have a video of it somewhere on their site

Marnie
31-05-2008, 09:42 AM
There are several links in Google (NZ) "Crown Apology Vietnam".

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 09:54 AM
I tried it bros as most poeple who go here know how to google. Thanks

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 09:56 AM
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/topic/story.cfm?c_id=123&objectid=10513138
Tears at long-awaited words

I want the actual speech and other speeches. Also, it is NZ or the Queen/England apologizes?

Speedy Gonzales
31-05-2008, 10:00 AM
Well look on the NZ govt site / TV1/3 website for the video.

I dont think anyone else apologised just Clarke

I dont think the Queen had anything to do with it either

Metla
31-05-2008, 10:01 AM
What are they apologising for?

Don't soldiers sign up knowing full well there job is to go to war?, To kill and be killed?


Why don't we apologise to the Vietnamese instead?

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 10:14 AM
What are they apologising for?

Don't soldiers sign up knowing full well there job is to go to war?, To kill and be killed?


Why don't we apologise to the Vietnamese instead?

I heard this many times before soldiers knew what their are into. Still they never expected the kind of treatment they got from any war, just Vietnam. I know this apology is just for the Vets by the way their were treated when they got home doing what was being asked of them over in Vietnam. So they should get some welcoming home for the jobs they did.

Metla
31-05-2008, 10:18 AM
So the apology was specifically for the treatment they received when they returned?

What did they get when they returned?, and what where they meant to get instead?

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 10:44 AM
The 35 year treatment they got has already been made obvious in the 35 years and recently in the news. Nzherald covers a lot of it.

Obviously, they got something not too great that NZ govt is only now apologizing, very reluctantly. Too little too late, but better late than never.

andrew93
31-05-2008, 11:28 AM
Once again this is election year hypocrisy. Helen Clarke was one of the protesters who jeered and spat at the returning servicemen. It highlights politicians will do anything in an election year, and her political stances are negotiable / situational.

Bring out the babies for the politicians to hug and kiss in front of the cameras!

Speaking of which, why would you hand your baby to a politician? Exactly what is going through the mind of the parent as they hand their baby over? If I were standing at an election rally, and if I happened to have a baby in my arms, and if I happened to be standing in the front row avoiding being crushed by adoring fans, the last thing I would do is let some politician get his greasy hands on my birth child (almost a Pulp Fiction quote...) :D

What I propose is we run a baby kissing bingo. The first person to provide documentary proof of an NZ politician kissing a baby before the election gets bragging rights.

royaloaks
31-05-2008, 12:03 PM
Helen Clarke would sell the soul of her Mum and Dad to keep her grip on power. She goes from screaming out " Baby murderers, Shame, Shame, Shame, to sucking up to the poor buggers that had to go on orders to Vietnam. What a bloody hypocrite!!!

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 01:44 PM
Why people hate politicians so much. No good ones out there given that they make all the decisions running the country.

Everybody does things they later regret or wish they can do better next time. Are you sayin that the apology is a PR stunt and someone else instead the head of NZ should be doing it. If other party in power, they would not be apologizing? What are we trying to say here?

Anyway, I am interested in reading the speeches on that historical day. Anyone heard of it and what do they think, especially the Maori party co-leader?

lightfoot
31-05-2008, 01:51 PM
"The apology will occur ahead of ‘Tribute08’ – a special weekend of commemorative events which honour Viet Nam veterans and their families, and celebrates their contributions to New Zealand", Helen Clark said.

Tribute08, being held over Queen's Birthday Weekend, begins on Friday afternoon. There will be a Civic Welcome in Civic Square, Wellington at 4.00pm. Rick Barker said the weekend has been organised largely by the veterans themselves with assistance from New Zealand Defence Force personnel. "

http://beehive.govt.nz/release/crown+apology+for+viet+nam+veterans+and+families

Anything is happening in Auckland?

Marnie
31-05-2008, 03:55 PM
Did you find the transcript/video of the speech? In case you didn't, both are on the TV3 site.

I believe that Australia made a similar formal apology 2 years ago.

I must just be cynical in thinking that it has a lot to do with it being election year. Shame on me...not!!! Most of us don't like hypocrites.

andrew93
31-05-2008, 05:05 PM
What are we trying to say here?
clarke is a hypocrite. Nothing more, nothing less other than if this weren't an election year then I doubt we'd be hearing it.

martynz
31-05-2008, 07:11 PM
Interesting editorial in the Dom Post yesterday
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4565207a6483.html

National were in power during the whole period in question.

Martynz

KenESmith
31-05-2008, 08:39 PM
She is a bloody hypocrite, and for her to fawn on those who served when she was publicly reviling them, should be taken as an insult.

From my observations as an ex regular serviceman in the New Zealand Armed Forces, for all too many years New Zealand has not valued the contribution there servicemen have made to the country.
During and immediately after the Viet Nam war the services were almost reviled by a significant section of the community, and grossly unappreciated and valued by the majority, and by and large are still unappreciated and undervalued.
Servicemen do not appreciate remarks, like "Why don't you get a real job! Its a pity you can't find a useful job! etc etc"

Successive Governments have almost as a matter of principal ensured that the Forces were ill equipped, and from what I gather from discussions with current serving personnel it has not improved to any degree..

lightfoot
02-06-2008, 10:06 PM
Interesting editorial in the Dom Post yesterday
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4565207a6483.html

National were in power during the whole period in question.

Martynz

Thanks for the link. The heading says:

"The Vietnam War was an unjust and, from the West's point of view, unwinnable conflict, fought on the basis of a series of fatally flawed premises, The Dominion Post writes."

I totally agree that it was an unjust, shameful and horrible war. But people should vent their anger at the decision makers and not all of the soldiers did the shameful deeds.

Do you think there will be an apology to the Vietnamese people? Or there is just enough moral fibre to apologize to NZ vets.

And I'm wondering why people cry hyprocites all the time. :crying

lightfoot
02-06-2008, 10:10 PM
Can someone confirm that Australia also apologized to the Vets or other countries as well?

andrew93
02-06-2008, 10:42 PM
Can someone confirm that Australia also apologized to the Vets or other countries as well?
Try using Google.

We may be a few hours ahead of Australia, but when it comes to recognising our servicemen we are about 2 years behind : http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2006/s1717751.htm

Sweep
02-06-2008, 11:44 PM
So is it Helen Clarke or Helen Clark as the current Prime Minister?

Is John Key going to be the next Prime Minister or possibly John Keys as some people say?

Should previous Governments have made an apology long before now?

The people that went to Vietnam served in the military at that time and were sent by the Government of the day.

New Zealand still sends military outside this country do they not!

Vietnam was not a war. It was treated as a minor conflict and a number of people protested at that time.

I was not one of them.

lightfoot
03-06-2008, 12:31 AM
Vietnam was not a war?

More than 2 times WWII bombs being dropped on Vietnam War, more than 70 millions of litres of agent oranges. Two point 6 millions of personnel sent from USA alone, not to mention other countries like NZ and Australia at the request of USA also sent personnel.

Vietnam was not a war. People are so ashame about it, they can't bring themselves to talk about what's really going on.

Don't get me started on this.

More statistics for you. Of the 2.6 millions personnel, 58,000 died from the Vietnam war, small conflict? And many more killed themselves out of shame and horror.

For NZ side, I think it was printed that 3,300 sent, 38 died. Do the math. It was about 2% chance of dying. With this kind of odds, you would think it was a picnic wouldn't you?