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bizzack
14-01-2006, 12:48 AM
At the moment I have a small network at home connected via a 4 port router. I have just had an extra person move in and they need to use the internet too. Can I just purchase a switch and hook that up? Is that all I would need to do?
Thanks!

DangerousDave
14-01-2006, 01:00 AM
You should be able to just buy a switch and plug it in as you say. I think with older routers IIRC they usually had a specific uplink port on them, in saying that, i don't think home networks have that anymore.

superuser
14-01-2006, 11:53 AM
Yep, easy just plug the switch into the router and then the PC's into the switch.

Should be a very easy swap e.g windows will pick it up with no further configuration.

bizzack
15-01-2006, 12:32 AM
cool, thanks I thought it was like that, just wanted to make sure :thumbs:

heni72847
15-01-2006, 08:13 AM
i think you need to have a cross-over cable between the router and the switch
if your router or switch can't cross over the cable electronically

correct me if i'm wrong..

Graham L
31-01-2006, 04:00 PM
Most switches will have one port marked "uplink", or will have one with a switch marked "X", or will autodetect. Each of these means no need for a crossover cable. Crossover cables are not something sane people want around a network. There are enough things which can go wrong without having "special" cables. :D

kingdragonfly
31-01-2006, 04:51 PM
Cross-over cables are not unusual, though as Graham states they're becoming a bit passe'.

I used to use colours to distinguish 'em. Black/white for normal, some arbitrary colour, such as green/purple for cross-over. I've also seen small plastic rings used for the same affect.

It's conceivable to tie a MAC address to a router/switch port, to stop the very thing you're trying, but this is only for secure environments.

Pete O'Neil
31-01-2006, 07:13 PM
U shudnt need to worry about uplink ports on any modern hardware, just grab any old network cable and connect the router and switch together. Most modern network gear these days can also detect a crossover or straight through cable and make the appropriate adjustments.

bizzack
01-02-2006, 01:23 AM
my flat mate has another router, can I just hook that up to my current router so that i have enough ports for everyone else, without having too much trouble?

Graham L
01-02-2006, 01:04 PM
I'd be inclined to try it. If it has multiple ports they are actually the ports of a switch. ;) (A router just deals with which side a packet is intended for. It needn't have more than two ports to work as a router). One side is connected to the internal switch. You might need to tell it not to do any routing, though it might twig that it hasn't got another side ("WAN") to connect to.

kingdragonfly
01-02-2006, 01:49 PM
A router separates TCP/IP subnets, where a switch/hub work within a subnet. Routers are "smart" complex devices, and by comparison switches/hub are "dumb" simple devices.

Long and short of it, you'll need to configure several network settings on throughout the network, if you have any hope of it working.

Generally not worth the trouble unless you're planning a large complex LAN.


my flat mate has another router, can I just hook that up to my current router so that i have enough ports for everyone else, without having too much trouble?

Graham L
01-02-2006, 02:11 PM
This sort of router has two ports. One goes to the WAN side. The other goes to the LAN side, with a switch on it,with multiple ports

(WAN)----(Router)----(LAN)---(switch)---ports

If there's nothing attached to the WAN side, it can't route packets from the LAN side out to it, and it won't get any packets from it to be routed to the LAN side.

If it doesn't know to do anything with LAN traffic on the switch, it won't do anything to traffic on the switch. The switch will work as a switch.

It's well worth trying. You might need to set the router up to do nothing. Nothing clever required.

Greven
01-02-2006, 03:14 PM
Whenever I have a LAN with my friends, we daisy chain a few ADSL routers together & don't have any trouble using them as dumb switches. I don't see why it would be any different for a router without the built in modem.

Murray P
01-02-2006, 03:33 PM
To save on cabling, you could hook the switch, or spare router, up on the nearest PC. It will all work the same as far as the person connecting to the net is concerned.

Simply_Si
02-02-2006, 01:12 AM
my flat mate has another router, can I just hook that up to my current router so that i have enough ports for everyone else, without having too much trouble?

If you are using an additional router you would need to be careful of the setup. Most adsl routers (and routers in general) assign addresses using dhcp and it wouldn't be a good idea to have both routers assigning addresses on the same net.

So either disable the dhcp server on one router and use the switch as suggested or plug the wan port into the existing router and have the additional PC connected through the switch side of the second router.

With the second option you would possibly need to reassign the router address though.

Have fun!

Big John
02-02-2006, 02:14 AM
A router separates TCP/IP subnets, where a switch/hub work within a subnet. Routers are "smart" complex devices, and by comparison switches/hub are "dumb" simple devices.



While Hubs are Dumb most switches are far from dumb and do much more than simply moving data. Hubs broadcast data to all and those that need it take it. Switches however only send data to those that requested it.
Some switches are even more complex and have IP addresses of their own that you program through.

kingdragonfly
02-02-2006, 11:15 AM
"Dumb" and "smart" are all relative. Routers have more intelligences since they have to be aware of two or more networks, and route traffic accordingly.

Graham L
02-02-2006, 01:26 PM
A hub is a "multiport repeater". It regenerates all the packets it receives on its RX side any port and retransmits them on its TX side of all ports. It pays no attention to the contents of the packets.

A switch is a "store and forward" device. It reads the addresses on packets. It remembers the addresses of the hosts connected to it, and it sends each packet to the host it's addressed to. It maintains its own table of IP:MAC mappings.

Because of this, I have the subversive idea that a hub will give a faster network if the network is small. :D A switch gains in a busy net because it avoids most collisions. (It can't avoid collisions caused by having a busy server) A small network which has no collisions will have reduced latency because the packets are just broadcast by the hub, rather than being stored, having some decisions made, then being transmitted to its desination by the switch. The speed difference would be small. I'm going to do some measurements one day.

kingdragonfly
02-02-2006, 03:40 PM
What constitutes a "switch" can become muddy, since some operate at OSI layer 2, and some at OSI layer 3, sometimes called "Multi-layer" switches

Here's an article called "Ethernet Networking Explained: Step by step instructions on setting up a PC Ethernet Local Area Network (LAN) of any size"
http://www.dansdata.com/network.htm

Here's one from Cisco, called "Troubleshooting Ethernet"
http://www.cisco.com/univercd/cc/td/doc/cisintwk/itg_v1/tr1904.htm