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Growly
19-06-2004, 12:48 PM
As you know, I like to complain about just about everything.

But this is different. Take a look at this:

http://sal.neoburn.net/imagef1/files/donotbend.jpg

As you can see, across the very front of the whole package, in big, bold letters, it says "DO NOT BEND". It was found in my mailmox, bent right down the middle, shoved in where the letters go (there is a space for bigger things round the side).

Inside was my CompTIA N+ certificate, and it was creased, right down the middle. Naturally, I'm distressed. I know that I can't do anything about it now, and calling them, will at best, merely get a meaningless apology, but I thought that i should tell everyone how plain stupid some post people are.

And the fact that they didnt see the bold, size 40 writing is no excuse - they should be dilligent.

Be careful when you trust your stuff to the post...

PS. Before everyone starts criticising me, I don't care.

Baldy
19-06-2004, 01:00 PM
Get an iron and smooth out the crease, but as you will probably get the certificate framed anyway, the framing people will have the technology to make the crease go away

BTW if you don't care, why post about it?

TonyF
19-06-2004, 01:22 PM
> As you know, I like to complain about just about
> everything.

Hello Growly. In this case, pay a personal call on your local postmaster with the evidence - no good merely phoning. I had a similar problem with the postie folding PCWNZ wi th CD inside, even though my box is a bit wider than A4. Made the call, Postmaster noted, and it has not happened since.
Most NZ mailboxes are still designed on the hole-in-the-front door style of yesteryear. In some other countries, there is a box with a liftup lid - much better.
Cheers Tony

Growly
19-06-2004, 01:40 PM
Cheers -

I don't care about the criticism towards me, that is, i wont be listening if they say it. (if you look at my last off topic post, it was all criticism)

Grrrrr bloomin mailmen...

metla
19-06-2004, 01:41 PM
My letter box has no back on it and is on an lean,so all mail slides straight out the back and into a puddle,from there the wind grabs it and redistributes it around the yard,then when my fortnightly yard crew arrive they shred it with their mowers and it retuerns to the earth.

Pretty sure Dell brouches and Warehouse rubbish mail alone have rasied the height of my section by a good 2 inches.

stu120404
19-06-2004, 01:46 PM
> Pretty sure Dell brouches and Warehouse rubbish mail
> alone have rasied the height of my section by a good
> 2 inches.

hehehe :D

Growly
19-06-2004, 02:11 PM
Heheheh, they're good enough to be manure....

(Bah doom boom chi)

whetu
19-06-2004, 02:41 PM
This happened to a friend of mine and his A+ certificate.. he bitched and nzpost paid for a replacement certificate ($45?) couriered (eg hand delivered due to sig req'd) to his door

Growly
19-06-2004, 02:45 PM
Awesome!!!!

DAMMIT - *runs and takes certificate out of book which is flattening it*...

nzStan
19-06-2004, 02:53 PM
> Pretty sure Dell brouches and Warehouse rubbish mail
> alone have rasied the height of my section by a good
> 2 inches.


ROTFLMAO!!!!!!! :^O :^O :^O

whiskeytangofoxtrot
19-06-2004, 03:06 PM
> This happened to a friend of mine and his A+
> certificate..

lol.... yeah, those A+ certificates are pretty valuable... which cereal box did it come off?

Growly
19-06-2004, 03:11 PM
> > This happened to a friend of mine and his A+
> > certificate..
>
> lol.... yeah, those A+ certificates are pretty
> valuable... which cereal box did it come off?


Far out dude, i take offense at that - I studied during school exams to pass that.

If you've nothing nice to say, don't.

whiskeytangofoxtrot
19-06-2004, 03:13 PM
> Far out dude, i take offense at that - I studied
> during school exams to pass that.
>
> If you've nothing nice to say, don't.

This from the guy who posts damn near nothing but threads whinging about things.

Growly
19-06-2004, 03:51 PM
>This from the guy who posts damn near nothing but threads whinging about >things.

Yes. Yes it is.

csinclair83
19-06-2004, 04:00 PM
you cant really blame the mailman...it mite not even be them...
since its from the United States..or sweden (stamp is swede but address is american) the post would have to go zillions of routes before getting in your mailbox....
Sweden to London probably then London to Aussie then here...then the sorting then sending to the relevent nz location then the postie and their bikes come and post it....

so it could have been bent in swden/usa...or it could have been bent here...

but still it shouldnt even be bent...

so I reckon you should complain to the NZ Post and say that you would settle for a replacement copy which is $xx and then thats the end of issue, and state a idea of when mail comes into NZ and its bent and not supposed to then stick a small sticker saying "damaged/bent on arrival to New Zealand" and then yeah, but of course that can be abused...

just complain to them at the top and hope u get somewhere :)

nzStan
19-06-2004, 04:01 PM
> > This happened to a friend of mine and his A+
> > certificate..
>
> lol.... yeah, those A+ certificates are pretty
> valuable... which cereal box did it come off?


IMHO That's a pretty low blow WTF. You want to consider apologising for that remark?

TonyF
19-06-2004, 04:32 PM
> IMHO That's a pretty low blow WTF. You want to
> consider apologising for that remark?
^^^^^^^
An unlikely action. Sadly, WTF seems to hold the forum record for nasty remarks. A strange trait - maybe he could shut up for a while....

nzStan
19-06-2004, 05:01 PM
>
>
> > IMHO That's a pretty low blow WTF. You want to
> > consider apologising for that remark?
> ^^^^^^^
> An unlikely action. Sadly, WTF seems to hold the
> forum record for nasty remarks. A strange trait -
> maybe he could shut up for a while....

I'll give credit where credit is due. I'm not a regular visitor altho for the last week PF1 was my outlet from work insanity. Having just scanned through most of WTF's old posts he has been helpful on most threads. Altho recently he seem to have swallowed a really bitter pill or something that didn't agree with him and his posts reflect that.

Irregardless of that, rubbishing someone's qualification is a big no-no for me. When I interview candidates I give all qualifications it due considerations, from certificates to degrees, it still require effort and money to gain these qualifications.

WTF if you have a sense of humility and humbleness I reckon a simple "Sorry" is called for.

~~~~~ s y ~~~~~
19-06-2004, 05:14 PM
c.f. User Rules # 1 and 6

I must say, "if you have nothing good to say, don't"! Same applies to your self Growly. You are not only criticising the mail man, but also, you're doing it without knowing it for sure. How do you know it wasn't the guys at the institution sending out the certificate? Trust me, there's a lot of unimaginable people out there. Please don't give us anymore of your non-sense post. Go post elsewhere if all you want to do is complain.

This may be bit harsh, but I strongly suggest you pay ChatF1 a visit. I have seen too often, conversations on the subject, "Growly and his....".

On the otherhand, I realise how you feel. The p word? I would be too, but please keep it to yourself. What was the main objective of the post?

Murray P
19-06-2004, 05:39 PM
WTF's remarks in this thread are not particularly helpful or by the looks of it welcome. Either ignore them or complain to Bruce if you have a real issue with them. Don't compound it by having a bleeding, aww he's soo nasty muma winge.

I know Growly is just venting his frustration, fair enough (BTW, I trust you're well insured G). We don't have to be bothered with it anyway if we don't want to be, get over it.

While I'm on my high horse and being hypercritical as well as a hypocrite:

> You are not only criticising the mail man, but also, you're doing it without
> knowing it for sure

Doesn't matter. He found it bent over in his mailbox, despite that, they are the entity charged with delivering the mail that he should go to. If they can prove it was not they that caused the damage them they should not deliver it without explanation. They are his point of contact re mail matters.

Cheers Murray P

kiki
19-06-2004, 05:43 PM
Of course it was the mailman, he had to fold it to get it into the mailbox.

Really if they are posting certificates they should be protected with stiff cardboard on either side of the certificate, or even rolled up and put into a poster box.

I would complain to the NZ post. Its just plain carelessness. However the general postie doesn't run a courier service, so if your mailbox was small, there would be no other way to get it in there than bending it.

Invest in a new mailbox? ;)

Growly
19-06-2004, 06:54 PM
Thankyou kiki and Murray, I appreciate what you've said.

I know my reputation on this forum is lousy, and for no other reason that the fact that I like to share my opinion. I share it, but I do not complain about other people on this forum, unless they complain first (childish, yes).

Sy, I didn't hassle a known person, and I didn't hassle a general group, I was angry with the person who undoubtedly folded the aforementioned certfication certficate in order to place it like i found it -bent- in the letter part of my mailbox.

As you can see, posting here obviously achieved something for me. I shared my experience with other people like me, and I found that it had happened to someone before, so I had someone's experiences to help me

I payed a visit to chatf1. Apparently they want me banned. The next two times no one had problems with me. I don't mean harm, I come here to help and to get help and, in some cases, to post my opinion... like many others.

I just don't understand why everything I say, or every post I start, has to end negatively. WTF didn't need to criticise my efforts, or those of others, and in my defense I am criticised!!

Once again - please do not post anything nasty - all I wanted was help!!!

kiki
19-06-2004, 07:25 PM
Maybe they just don't like Russians hiding in their nuclear silos ]:)

metla
19-06-2004, 08:02 PM
Poeple wanted you banned?

lmao,thats the funniest thing i have read all day,

any idea who it was?


Wonder what the results would be if a poll was run on banning me then?

kiki
19-06-2004, 08:07 PM
> lmao,thats the funniest thing i have read all day,

Yes for sure lol! Who was it? We want names!

> Wonder what the results would be if a poll was run on banning me then?

You would get 3 votes against I think. One from Elephant, one from that drcspy guy? I think it was you who was fighting with him, and that other guy who was fighting with you and made a thread moaning about you. Can't remember who that was now, but blimin hilarious. :D

Winston001
19-06-2004, 08:31 PM
I agree with Metla and have no problem with Growly. Perhaps the issues could be a little more calmly expressed but passion is important. And it can be fun. Nothing like a good argument to get the juices flowing.

Billy T
19-06-2004, 08:46 PM
Hi Growly

I've no problems with your posts, but could I make a simple suggestion?

Less is more!

How about injecting just a little more balance in your post statistics? 50-50 help vs winge would be an improvement. There is little enough to smile about some days and finding PF1 clogged with OT complaints about trival annoyances does get a little wearying. The entertainment value drops away quite steeply and you are likely to lose your audience if you keep it up.

Not that I mind the OT stuff, I've said it before on PF1, we need all types. It is good for a dog to catch a few fleas, it stops him from worrying about the fact that he's a dog. (Loosely translated, hearing your gripes makes us count our own blessings.)

Cheers

Billy 8-{) :D

Growly
19-06-2004, 09:32 PM
It's interesting...

maybe all my helpful ones are ignored?

Billy T
20-06-2004, 12:24 AM
Could be true Growly, it doesn't take much pi** to spoil the pot.

I recall an old quotation:

"The evil that men do lives after them, the good is oft interred with their bones."

Think about it.

Cheers

Billy 8-{)

mark c
20-06-2004, 12:50 AM
Yay! Bad people are immortal!

Jester
20-06-2004, 02:05 AM
poor Growly - I kinda like ya mate - to do what you have done and to know what you know at your age is an inspiration. Remember folks, we can't all be tactful 'straight from the box', that takes time to develop

:D

KatiMike
20-06-2004, 02:41 AM
Growly , metla , Billy T , gotta love you guys [ and girl] - encourage discussion and comment , and you've got the smarts , Happy Sunday

Murray P
20-06-2004, 03:05 AM
All too true Jester, well spoken.

Growly don't take it to heart but, as Winny says, have passion which, judging by your posts, you have heaps of. Then again take heed of Billy's advice, too much of a good thing inures us to the real thing. So:

Ensure first you have a complaint. (hows your letter box).

Ensure second that you complain where it will be heard and loud (piss off, I don't give a dam),

Third, if you don't get results from the second, ensure you go to the place you'll get the best results for your fourth action.

Cheers Murray P

PS. If all the above fail, have a good *****.

kiki
20-06-2004, 03:12 AM
> Growly, metla, Billy T, gotta love you guys [ and girl]

Which one of them is a female? :O

drcspy
20-06-2004, 09:29 AM
since someone mentioned me........I"ve never to my recollection had any issue here with anyone at all except WTF who is seems many others haev issues with as well.............and I agree that his comment to growly about the worth of his certificate was a bit crappy... Growly put in a lot of effort for that cert, thought it was worth getting and worked to get it and to devalue his efforts with a throwaway comment like 'what weetbix box did you get that off' is deliberate and not too nice

drcspy
20-06-2004, 09:32 AM
Good on ya Growly .........and yep I'd be asking the P.O to explain what happened too........also i'd possibly wait for the next time I saw that postie and ask that person to explain also.......on the assumption that it was them who folded the package even tho it said in LARGE lettering NOT to fold.........

Billy T
20-06-2004, 11:36 AM
> Which one of them is a female? :O

?:| Yesterday was Saturday, so it can't have been me.:|

Cheers

Billy 8-{)

SKT174
20-06-2004, 11:53 AM
Be it a looking for help thread or complain thread. What ever thread Growly starts, if you don't like him, why even bother to get inside the thread to read it and then post something utterly useless or something offensive to waste your own time?

If you don't like the topic then why bother reading it in the 1st place?

Billy T
20-06-2004, 12:50 PM
> If you don't like the topic then why bother reading
> it in the 1st place?

Good logic SKT, but futile. People will read regardless, because curiosity (nosiness?) is an incurable human trait.

Witness some of the classic and occasionally vitriolic PF1 threads in the past that had to be locked to prevent apoplexy. They may have started innocently, and nobody forced the dissenters to logon or to post, but they were driven by their own personal demons and neither logic nor reason would sway them from their path.

It is all part of life's rich tapestry, so sit back and enjoy; or not, as the pleasure takes you.

Cheers

Billy 8-{) :D
Not all animals in the zoo are warm and cuddly.:(

Growly
20-06-2004, 05:45 PM
I love you guys.

Growly
20-06-2004, 05:47 PM
I've decided that all my efforts are futile.

Last night I found out that my brand new $300 case was broken - and at 16KG would cost me a bit to send back to auckland. My new motherboard arrives tomorrow - and I have no where to put it.

Don't come close to me, whatever bad omen I am, I do not wish to spread it...

kiki
20-06-2004, 05:59 PM
What? Your case was broken? How?

nzStan
20-06-2004, 06:01 PM
Hmmm which landing craft??? Hmmmmm.....

Sorry to hear about your case. What exactly is wrong with it? Was it the PSU or power switch? Maybe if you can confirm with the supplier to send back the component for a replacement?

Andrew B
20-06-2004, 06:26 PM
Growly, If your case was broken when you received it, lodge a damage claim with the company that delivered it. You shouldn't have to send it back, tell the company that delivered it to come and collect it from you. And make sure you still have all the packaging that it came in, they might want to check it to determine whether it provided adequate protection.

Baldy
20-06-2004, 07:11 PM
> I've decided that all my efforts are futile.
>
> Last night I found out that my brand new $300 case
> was broken - and at 16KG would cost me a bit to send
> back to auckland. My new motherboard arrives tomorrow
> - and I have no where to put it.
>
> Don't come close to me, whatever bad omen I am, I do
> not wish to spread it...

If it was broken when you received it, ring the supplier and get him to courier it back (at his cost) and have it repaired or replaced......
Or did you break it putting in all the old computer bits (as per what you talked about on one of your other threads?)

Wayne H
20-06-2004, 08:28 PM
In another Thread WTF said

Whilst working in IT, I am paying over $6k per year and working my ass off to complete a full-time qualification in a medical field, which ironically when I graduate (6 months to go thank God) is going to pay less than the job I am curently doing with no formal qualifications.

So WTF has not had the intense pleasure of having to sit an IT exam under recorded camera and audio surveillance, while paying $300 a pop for the privilege. (from memory A+ is two exams.)

Good on you. and congrats.

~~~~~ s y ~~~~~
20-06-2004, 08:46 PM
Wayne, what does this have to do with the post. It's probably not the best issue to bring in.

My sympathies go with you, Growly, re: your case. By all means, demand that the supplier pay for the couriers back.

Have you settled on the Asus A7N8X-Deluxe mobo? Or are they being sent from Auz?

Wayne H
20-06-2004, 09:00 PM
True,
it was just sad seeing a qual being demeened by some one who has been and is still curently very helpful to most serious questions asked.

Growly
20-06-2004, 10:22 PM
Hi everyone -

Yeah I went for the A7N8XE - deluxe... but as for my case...

I bought the thermaltake Xaser 5 Damier, which has a big EL light down the front. It turned on once, and the next time i turned it on, nothing.

I didn't do anything between the working time and the non working time, so I'm confused.

*Sigh*

Thanks everyone.

whiskeytangofoxtrot
20-06-2004, 10:36 PM
> So WTF has not had the intense pleasure of having to
> sit an IT exam under recorded camera and audio
> surveillance, while paying $300 a pop for the
> privilege. (from memory A+ is two exams.)

Oh how kind of you to quote me... I'm honoured.

I've sat a shedload of exams in my time, am still doing so up to this very day so I am very aware of exam frustrations. Whilst an IT exam under camera and audio surveillance is difficult, I regularly sit practical assessments under the scrutiny of three senior staff, and a doctor watching my every move - every bit as testing, if not more so.

I have also had the questionable pleasure of working with a number of people who love to sign their e-mail "Joe Bloggs A+" as if they were a Doctor or of some other importance other than self.

I am yet to meet anyone with an A+ qualification that has had any really impressive computer skills or knowledge, even rudimentary at that.

I'd be happy to be proved wrong, however I only draw on personal experience of which none is positive.

Wayne H
20-06-2004, 11:18 PM
I stand corrected and humbly appologize.
However I do not think that at 14 Yrs old Growly would be doing things like that yet. and by the time he does there would be a lot more letters after his name and half a degree, if the way he carries on is anything to go by.

Chilling_Silence
20-06-2004, 11:34 PM
Personally, My beliefs are that the piece of paper is only proof that you can do what the exam requires.
For example, if you sit through an 8 hour grueling RHCE Exam, then you can safely say that:
I can install Redhat, Configure BIND etc etc etc....

If you sit Joe Bloggs A++ Certification, while it isnt NZQA, it is still proof that you can do XYZ, although I personally would only count the NZQA Certs because they are proven to be a degree of competancy.

Then again, you can still some skill, without the piece of paper.

WTF>
What's up with your comments man? I dont think Growly's ever bitten your head off... Live and let live.

Growly>
Bummer about the Cert, hope you get it, and your Case replaced!


Chill.

Growly
21-06-2004, 06:05 PM
I still love you guys.

I understand what you say WTF - I know many people think lowly of the Comptia exams... and I have to admit, It was easy. This didn't take away the moths of fretting an worrying, or the the fact that I had other exams to study for, but it was easier than I thought.

I would compare it to the CCNA exam - which is rather annoying because some schools offer CCNA for free.

Now I want CCIE....

Baldy
22-06-2004, 01:03 AM
There is good money to be made out of fake certificates.

cappuccino
22-06-2004, 06:10 AM
> There is good money to be made out of fake
> certificates.


..... and a 'Graphic Artist' would know about these things....

Baldy
22-06-2004, 08:16 AM
> > There is good money to be made out of fake
> > certificates.
>
>
> ..... and a 'Graphic Artist' would know about these
> things....
>

FYI Polly - Its been big news here (Some news dosen't get as far as The Netherlands)
http://tvnz.co.nz/view/news_national_story_skin/431920?format=html

Billy T
22-06-2004, 10:45 AM
> I have also had the questionable pleasure of working
> with a number of people who love to sign their e-mail
> "Joe Bloggs A+" as if they were a Doctor or of some
> other importance other than self.

IMHO, becoming Dr. WTF M.D. or whatever medical qualification you are studying for would make working with you a questionable pleasure too, if you maintain your present abrasive attitude.

It is not the qualification that earns you respect WTF, that is just the passport to your chosen occupation; it is the way you relate to your fellow man. It is the humanity, patience and understanding you show, your ability to empathise with patients (clients) who can't adequately explain their problem to you but desperately need your help, and your ability to maintain that high standard when dealing with every stratum of society from the unlovably wealthy to the unlovably poor that makes you a professional and earns you respect.

On your present performances, which, although often skilled, are consistently abrasive, I would neither employ you nor consult with you for reasons of attitude unbecoming and unprofessional.

That's just my opinion of course, but I know a little of what I am talking about through nearly 40 years of providing personal service to clients across the full breadth of New Zealand society, from the incredibly rich to the unbelievably poor. I have met absolute bastards and delightfully charming people at both ends and in the middle, but not once have I departed from professional standards of courtesy and service. Why would I? My feelings were personal and my income depended on my ability to separate personal from business and maintain my professionalism.

Your attitude is illustrated below:

> I am yet to meet anyone with an A+ qualification that
> has had any really impressive computer skills or
> knowledge, even rudimentary at that.

Hyperbole doesn't prove any points WTF, but your choice of language does. In your attempts to put down those who study for A+ or any other qualification you deem to be beneath you, it appears you lost touch with the english language.

Rudiment n. elements or first principles of knowledge or some subject, not advanced or developed (hence rudimentary).

I possess rudimentary skills with computers, I am not a novice but nor am I anywhere near the standard needed to sit A+. Maybe, just maybe these A+ people know a few things you don't. They didn't get their qualification by not having a better than rudimentary knowledge.


Knowledge is important WTF, but the manner with which the man (or woman) carries it is even more important, because they are the window through which that knowledge must shine. Knowledge should not be coloured by the personal prejudices and attitudes of the holder.

If you plan a career in which your ability to relate to and communicate directly with your fellow man is important, I'd seriously consider getting professional counselling to overcome your negative attitudes. Otherwise they will pop out when you least expect them and may consign your carreer to the back rooms: "Clever man but can't get on with patients."


> I'd be happy to be proved wrong, however I only draw
> on personal experience of which none is positive.

Likewise, I agree 100% with this statement, in fact in the context of this thread and the issues it embraces, I endorse it wholeheartedly.


Learn to suffer fools gladly WTF, your future may depend on that ability.

Cheers

Billy 8-{)

Winston001
22-06-2004, 11:12 AM
Good post Billy. Lots of commonsense. I don't want to prolong this thread but I have a soft spot for WTF.

I think his point is that some of these qualifications come very cheaply. In the sense that the courses are shallow and their educational value is low. No fault of the students who feel justifiably proud of their achievement.

IT in particular is sexy, so lots of Polytechs etc try to teach it. They don't make the entry standard too hard because they want the enrollments.

Thus is the currency of our education debased. :(

nzStan
22-06-2004, 11:17 AM
> It is not the qualification that earns you respect
> <snipped>, that is just the passport to your chosen
> occupation; it is the way you relate to your fellow
> man. It is the humanity, patience and understanding
> you show, your ability to empathise with <snipped> clients who can't adequately explain their problem
> to you but desperately need your help, and your
> ability to maintain that high standard when dealing
> with every stratum of society from the unlovably
> wealthy to the unlovably poor that makes you a
> professional and earns you respect.

Billy, can I have permission to copy your quote? Man, I want to pin this up on a noticeboard to remind my department on its Customer Service attitude.

Jim B
22-06-2004, 12:07 PM
> but not once have I
> departed from professional standards of courtesy and
> service. Why would I? My feelings were personal and
> my income depended on my ability to separate personal
> from business and maintain my professionalism.


There's no secret about success. Did you ever know a successful man who didn't tell you about it?
Kin Hubbard (1868 - 1930)


If A is success in life, then A equals x plus y plus z. Work is x; y is play; and z is keeping your mouth shut.
Albert Einstein (1879 - 1955)

pulling hair out
22-06-2004, 01:15 PM
Billy T.

Your comments were brilliant. Give your parents a huge hug and I hope they had many children with your humantarian views so that they will go out and propogate.

Marg.

whiskeytangofoxtrot
22-06-2004, 02:43 PM
> IMHO, .............

Was pretty sure that stands for in my humble opinion, not in my self indulging arrogant belittling think I can fix everyones life opinion.

Wow Billy T, your insight has just changed my life, I've booked a plane and am on my way to a monastery in the far reaches of Mongolia to learn my inner self, as you seem to know so much more about me than I do.

Seriously S T F U. You don't know me, you know nothing about me. All you have to base your deprecating opinions on me of are a few posts on a random message board on the internet.

How dare you try and cross over and direct my personal and professional life . I only wish that I could have such delusions of self grandeur that I could do just that - seriously I think you are the one that needs more help than I do.

Pull your head in.

Chilling_Silence
22-06-2004, 03:04 PM
> How dare you try and cross over and direct my
> personal and professional life . I only wish that I
> could have such delusions of self grandeur that I
> could do just that - seriously I think you are the
> one that needs more help than I do.
>
> Pull your head in.

From what Ive gathered, you are the condescending one, not Billy T. Practise what you preach, before you head off to your monestry!

Murray P
22-06-2004, 03:08 PM
Hi Billy

Your viewpoint on professional conduct are IMO correct and very eloquently put and should be the basis to all social dealings we have, not just business. If everyone achieved that level of competence in their interaction with their fellow man, we wouldn't have to discuss the various types we have to put up with by sucking it in and getting on. Too much to ask really, with human nature being what it is but, hope springs eternal.

Unfortunately, in this instance, I think you have treated Whiskey too harshly. In fact, in parts it seems you are arguing the same points but obviously from divergent angles. If you could discuss this civilly you would probably realise this, even worse you may realise this but cannot bring youself(ves) to act accordingly.

Ok! so this is not a business matter, why the difference?

I think the point that Whiskey, Winnie, et al make with regard to the apparent cheapening of qualifications and education (not to be confused) is a very salient one. One, that as a parent I have concerns for.

BTW, I'm afraid I do not live up to the high ideals expressed even though I try to. I have told clients or prospective clients (politely) to find their needs elsewhere for various reasons from technical, financial to downright personality or morality clash. For the latter two I am not prepared to suck it in and grin.

Overall a great read though :)

Cheers Murray P

whiskeytangofoxtrot
22-06-2004, 03:11 PM
> From what Ive gathered, you are the condescending
> one

You don't see me telling people how they will function in their personal and professional life, that's pretty condescending if you ask me.

Murray P
22-06-2004, 03:11 PM
Slow typer that I am I missed the good bits between Marg's post and mines.

Crikey guys! if you throw it any harder you'll break the fan then you'll have to start pushing it with your forks.

Cheers Murray ;P

nzStan
22-06-2004, 04:04 PM
seriously I think you are the
> one that needs more help than I do.
>

Billy T?? Nope I don't think so, from what I have read of his post it's been pretty level headed.

Biggles
22-06-2004, 04:15 PM
WTF cool it please.

You made a contentious, and it could be percieved arrogant statement about A+.

>I have also had the questionable pleasure of working with a number of people who love to sign their e-mail "Joe Bloggs A+" as if they were a Doctor or of some other importance other than self.

From where I sit it I'd be pretty annoyed if I had studied hard for an A+ qual only to have you right it off as "self" important.

Prior to that you dumped on other folks - Growly for exmaple - without provocation. So frankly I don't have much symapthy if you find Billy T's response to all that offensive.

I'm now locking the thread.