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Darryl
11-01-2004, 10:06 PM
What are fines like 4 illegally downloading files from kazaa?

metla
11-01-2004, 10:08 PM
Drunken circus performers break into your house and beat you with rubber mallets.

Why not just post in the thread you made earlier?

And forget the fines,Your either quite prepared to break the law or your not.

whiskeytangofoxtrot
11-01-2004, 11:50 PM
Not certain myself, but these people here (http://www.courts.govt.nz/) and here (http://www.police.govt.nz/) may have some info for you.

hamstar
12-01-2004, 01:18 AM
In 1998 I believe it was $5000 per object up to $50000 and/or/then 3 months inprisonment

yingxuan
12-01-2004, 03:47 AM
I don't think u can get sued in new zealand right?It only goes for australia.
I download chinese music.Hmm am i safe?Nobody has been sued on chinese music

albatross
12-01-2004, 07:55 AM
It seems to me that the only reason you have joined F1, is to get assistance and support for illegal activities, and the replies you have received so far should tell you quite clearly that the members here have no interest what so ever in helping you in that respect,me included.Maybe you should use your time to find a new forum that does support what you are trying to do,and not waste our time.

godfather
12-01-2004, 08:42 AM
> I don't think u can get sued in new zealand right?It
> only goes for australia.
> I download chinese music.Hmm am i safe?Nobody has
> been sued on chinese music

Wake up to reality yingxuan.

Theft and copyright violation is an international issue, you have no more right to illegally download "Chinese music" than Microsoft Office, where the original work is copyright.

Theft and copyright violation convictions can have serious implications on your future life.

Where a conviction is for an offence that can carry a term of imprisonment (irrespective of imprisonment being done or not) then your ability to travel overseas, gain employment in NZ or overseas is severely compromised.

Its not like a speeding ticket.

somebody
12-01-2004, 08:53 AM
> I download chinese music.Hmm am i safe?Nobody has
> been sued on chinese music

Maybe you'll be the first ;)

kiwibeat
12-01-2004, 09:21 AM
Unless you are selling and distributing songs for profit on a large scale you should be ok , and its easier to borrow a cd from a friend or the library and rip to HDD for music

hamstar
12-01-2004, 11:35 AM
I think this is a good place to put this...

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/12/30/1072546532286.html

agent
12-01-2004, 12:42 PM
But you've already posted that link in another thread not three days ago!

I just wonder if what's said in that article would apply to New Zealand, considering we are a much smaller country, and we haven't finished our own Idol competition yet, and all that sort of stuff which makes everything apply differently.

hamstar
12-01-2004, 12:55 PM
>I just wonder if what's said in that article would apply to New Zealand, considering we are a much smaller country, and we haven't finished our own Idol competition yet, and all that sort of stuff which makes everything apply differently.
Good Point. But it does show the music industry is not dying because of music piracy... but I still ain't downloading NZ music.

Jester
12-01-2004, 02:57 PM
<tongue in cheek>It's just that no one ever uses the programs like Kazaa that are available from magazine discs (yep - PCWorld included) to share files, including music mp3's.

The programs are only there on the discs and downloadable off the net to see how they work.

There are millions of people on Kazaa right now, seeing 'how it works'. </tongue in cheek>

ugh1
12-01-2004, 03:26 PM
&gt; &gt; I don't think u can get sued in new zealand
&gt; right?It
&gt; &gt; only goes for australia.
&gt; &gt; I download chinese music.Hmm am i safe?Nobody has
&gt; &gt; been sued on chinese music
&gt;
&gt; Wake up to reality yingxuan.
&gt;
&gt; Theft and copyright violation is an international
&gt; issue, you have no more right to illegally download
&gt; "Chinese music" than Microsoft Office, where the
&gt; original work is copyright.
&gt;
&gt; Theft and copyright violation convictions can have
&gt; serious implications on your future life.
&gt;
&gt; Where a conviction is for an offence that can carry a
&gt; term of imprisonment (irrespective of imprisonment
&gt; being done or not) then your ability to travel
&gt; overseas, gain employment in NZ or overseas is
&gt; severely compromised.
&gt;
&gt; Its not like a speeding ticket.

Oh dear, perhaps you should stop listening to music on the radio, after all you do not have permission from the recording company to listen to the music.

Also you had better make sure that your stereo cannot be heard by any one else then you as you do not have permission to play it to a public audience.

Also you had better not have your VCR connected to your TV while any movies are playing... or have it viewable by any 3rd party.

If you happen to use your camcorder in a public place, if you have one, then make sure you get permission from every 3rd party you happen to capture on tape..

Also don't forget to mention in EVERY bit of material you type that microsoft(tm) is a trade marked name...

If you have done any of the above then YOU have broken the law and fines / prison applies.

Before preaching to others insure you are pure first &lt;grin&gt;

agent
12-01-2004, 04:06 PM
I suspect godfather would be much more clued up about his rights and the law than you.

You are allowed to tape content off television using a VCR, DVD recorder, or other such medium, because it is well within the fair use of television broadcasts. The only time you would really run into trouble with that is if you sold those copies you made, or screened them to a public audience - showing them to your friends is fine too, I believe.

Fair use encompasses a wide range of things, and I should think most of us think that making backups for our own use is fair (even if it is not legal in our country), but distributing those backups is very much in breach of copyright law.

ugh1
12-01-2004, 05:05 PM
> I suspect godfather would be much more clued up about
> his rights and the law than you.

Never argue with a laywer<grin>

>
> You are allowed to tape content off television using
> a VCR, DVD recorder, or other such medium, because it
> is well within the fair use of television broadcasts.
> The only time you would really run into trouble with
> that is if you sold those copies you made, or
> screened them to a public audience - showing them to
> your friends is fine too, I believe.

No, friends are 3rd parties. Fair use applies to many things..<grin>

>
> Fair use encompasses a wide range of things, and I
> should think most of us think that making backups for
> our own use is fair (even if it is not legal in our
> country), but distributing those backups is very much
> in breach of copyright law.

Offsite backup is permitted<grin>
You can have as many backups as you like, but only one occurrence of the programme can be running at a time, unless the license permits more then one occurrence to be running at a time.

We are all a little guilty of breaking the law in one way or another, so slamming others is a bit harsh<grin>

Graham L
12-01-2004, 05:25 PM
"never argue with a lawyer"???
Is this a lawyer saying it is illegal to listen to music broadcast on radio?

Ignorance of the law is no defence. Even for a lawyer. :D

I am entitled to listen to music broadcast by radio stations. The stations keep records of every piece they broadcast. The lists are sent to the performance rights agencies. With the fees. :D I am not entitled to have a radio going in "my" shop or restaurant without a licence (and payment of a fee).

I am entitled to photograph anyone in a public place. I will need releases from people in the shots only if I wish to use the results commercially.

I am not a lawyer. ;-)

The copyright laws are a mess.

agent
12-01-2004, 06:12 PM
Oh, well, okay then. I still maintain that the friends thing is fine - given that a small group of friends (say, less than 10) watching a movie taped off telly doesn't exactly count as a public audience in my mind.

Speaking of the backups, I was talking about audio CDs, as it's my understanding that in NZ we cannot backup audio CDs in case they get scratched etc.

Yes, okay, you say you're a lawyer, but godfather is well reputed here on many, many, topics.

ugh1
12-01-2004, 08:33 PM
> "never argue with a lawyer"???
> Is this a lawyer saying it is illegal to listen to
> music broadcast on radio?

No, I thought godfather was a lawyer?

>
> Ignorance of the law is no defence. Even for a
> lawyer. :D

I agree.

>
> I am entitled to listen to music broadcast by radio
> stations. The stations keep records of every piece
> they broadcast. The lists are sent to the
> performance rights agencies. With the fees. :D I am
> not entitled to have a radio going in "my" shop or
> restaurant without a licence (and payment of a
> fee).

Ahh, and there is the catch, the radio station can play the music, but no individual is granted rights to listen too it, silly I know but that is the way it is..

>
> I am entitled to photograph anyone in a public place.
> I will need releases from people in the shots only
> if I wish to use the results commercially.

Or publish them, i.e. on a web page. I got caught out on that one.

>
> I am not a lawyer. ;-)

Neither am I.

>
> The copyright laws are a mess.

I agree, which is why one who makes comments on file sharing being illegal or legal is just that, a comment.

It is not illegal for you to share your own works or material, like wise allot of classical music has no copyright.

Winston001
12-01-2004, 08:51 PM
Ok. There was an article by a friend of mine in the Southland Times about 6 months ago detailing our arcane copyright laws. Specifically the issue of videos and music was covered. I am a lawyer and I freely admit I did not know a lot of the details in the article. If I can find it or get a copy I will post a summary (with the authors consent of course).

In the meantime, I can say that in NZ it is unlawful to copy music or software - at all. In the USA it is lawful to make one copy for your personal archive purposes.

Frankly I am not certain about the criminal sanctions for breach of copyright - if any, although I suspect that multiple copies is Theft under the Crimes Act and would be prosecuted by the Police as such.

Mostly the noise about file-sharing of music is made by recording companies who seek civil remedies. No Police involvement. Breach of copyright is a civil wrong. That means the owner can sue the person who commits the breach. No different in NZ to New York.

Where there is a difference is the remedies. In the US the Courts regularly give large judgements as compared with our own system. So being sued in the US for making music available on Kazza would be a serious problem - bankruptcy. It wouldn't be a happy experience here either but a record company would need to believe they were making a very significant example before they would go to the time and expense.

File-sharing music is generally unlawful. We may all do it, just as tape cassettes werre used in the past, but it is still naughty.