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View Full Version : This could be serious. How do I find out?



Pauline
02-10-2002, 09:38 AM
My daughter got an Email from one of her acquaintences in Australia. He was not a happy chappie. His message came from Hotmail & he said he had it set to autosend after he had done what he threatened. We are a bit concerned & not sure what to do next. In the Email he more or less blamed her. Any comments much appreciated.
Pauline.

Greg S
02-10-2002, 09:42 AM
Hi. Your question's a little vague. Could you elaborate on what the actual problem is, eg blamed her for what?

Lohsing
02-10-2002, 10:22 AM
Hmmm... my imagination has run wild... Suicide?? :o

Lohsing
02-10-2002, 10:22 AM
as in :O

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 11:01 AM
Can you auto send later on hotmail?

With all the bleating about hotmail, there should be someone here with a hotmail account?

Perhaps someone could have a looksee to find out if this medium-tech guilt trip is technicly possible?

Chilling_Silence
02-10-2002, 11:03 AM
OeX - Send Later... Works with hotmail too shouldn't it???

Set the prog to load up a t a set time an it'll auto send/receive! Dont see why it wont work with hotmail compared to a regular email.

Chilling_Silence
02-10-2002, 11:04 AM
Now you just need to tell us what he threatened... It might be serious, might not be!

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 11:13 AM
Ok, so send later could clearly be done with a hotmail address if it was sent from the users computer.

But can it be done as a setting within hotmails web interfacel, such as if it was sent from an email café?

SoniKalien
02-10-2002, 11:25 AM
AFAIK Hotmail has an auto respond (holiday message) I have a hotmail acct but never touch the damn thing...

Sorry, what was the question again?

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 11:36 AM
SoniKalien,
With hotmail is it possible to cruise of to the nearest email café and write something that sits for a day or what ever and then sends itself automaticly?

Pauline,
Look at the headers, you willl be able to tell a bit about where it came from and when from that .
Click on the message once > rightclick > properties > details > message sourse
you should see some thing like:

Return-Path: <xxxxxxxxxx@snap.net.nz>
Delivered-To: xxxxxxxx@paradise.net.nz
X-Envelope-To: xxxxxx@paradise.net.nz
Received: (qmail 80925 invoked from network); 30 Sep 2002 09:34:59 -0000
Received: from ip210-55-105-82.valentine.co.nz (HELO chronus.interspeed.co.nz) (210.55.105.82)
by pop3-2.paradise.net.nz with SMTP; 30 Sep 2002 09:34:59 -0000
Received: from tyler.snap.net.nz (tyler.snap.net.nz [202.37.101.20])
by chronus.interspeed.co.nz (Postfix) with ESMTP id B285C212039
for <chris@xxxxxxx.co.nz>; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 21:34:59 +1200 (NZST)
Received: from p80-dialup.snap.net.nz ([203.97.31.80] helo=imanangel)
by tyler.snap.net.nz with smtp (Exim 3.22 #1 )
id 17vwx8-0001Pr-00
for <chris@xxxxxxxx.co.nz>; Mon, 30 Sep 2002 21:34:58 +1200
Message-ID: < (big random number) @imanangel>
.................(rest of message)..................

This will tell you where it came from, and who it went through. If it came from the users computer it show here have a look, it will offer clues as to if this was a delayed send or not.

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 11:50 AM
Hotmails IPs are 64.4.x.x
if the mail didnt come from something withing that IP range, then it was send directly from the users computer.

Pauline
02-10-2002, 12:24 PM
Hi Chris,
I copied this from the headers as you suggested but it doesn't mean anything to me
Received: from 203.97.2.243 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP;
Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:50:44 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [203.97.2.243]
Yes Lohsing you guessed right.
I might just send a message to his account & see if there is any reply. It's hard not knowing if he was serious or not.
Pauline.

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 12:36 PM
Ok, not the full headers, but i does seem to be from a webbased account. This leads back to the question

Is it possible to send a delayed message with webbased hotmail?
Surely theres someone here who uses hotmail that could answer that!?

Greg S
02-10-2002, 12:40 PM
Hotmail can be set up to be used like a POP account from an email client, ergo almost certainly it can be set to auto-send.

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 12:46 PM
Yes but surely if it was sent through an email client, it wouldn't have gone through "sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com"...

refer header exert below


Received: from 203.97.2.243 by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP;
Mon, 30 Sep 2002 12:50:44 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [203.97.2.243]

Chilling_Silence
02-10-2002, 01:39 PM
I traced it (Search google for Neotrace Express Download)


OrgName: Asia Pacific Network Information Centre
OrgID: APNIC

NetRange: 202.0.0.0 - 203.255.255.255
CIDR: 202.0.0.0/7
NetName: APNIC-CIDR-BLK
NetHandle: NET-202-0-0-0-1
Parent:
NetType: Allocated to APNIC
NameServer: ns1.apnic.net
NameServer: ns3.apnic.net
NameServer: ns.ripe.net
NameServer: rs2.arin.net
NameServer: dns1.telstra.net
Comment: This IP address range is not registered in the ARIN database.
For details, refer to the APNIC Whois Database via
WHOIS.APNIC.NET or http://www.apnic.net/apnic-bin/whois2.pl
** IMPORTANT NOTE: APNIC is the Regional Internet Registry
for the Asia Pacific region. APNIC does not operate networks
using this IP address range and is not able to investigate
spam or abuse reports relating to these addresses. For more
help, refer to http://www.apnic.net/info/faq/abuse

RegDate: 1994-04-05
Updated: 2002-09-11

OrgTechHandle: SA90-ARIN
OrgTechName: System Administrator, System
OrgTechPhone: +61 7 3858 3100
OrgTechEmail:

ARIN Whois database, last updated 2002-09-30 19:05
Enter ? for additional hints on searching ARIN's Whois database.


AKA - There's no IP addy now. AFAIK, It was from Asia Pacific which sounds right.

If they do it again, trace it ASAP

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 01:44 PM
OK according to honey laser

>No. You are able to set up "reminders" which email you on a specified date, but thats all. I don't believe you have ever been able to do that.

As this message was sent from hotmails webased system, not an email client, i could not have been time delayed.

Chilling_Silence
02-10-2002, 01:49 PM
Why does it have to be web-based though? It would still hav the same IP addy wouldn't it? Wether its sent from my PC via OeX of via IE and Hotmail, What about MSN Explorer??? Can that do it?

Chilling_Silence

Chris Wilson
02-10-2002, 02:01 PM
If it went from a email client it would get sent from 203.97.2.243 > local smtp server > paulines pop3 server > paulines comp with maybe a couple of extra steps allong the way.

The posted headers show that first stop after the users computer was not the local smtp sever, but was by sea2fd.sea2.hotmail.msn.com

From this i assume it was webbased, possibly an internet café or the such like.

Graham Petrie
02-10-2002, 02:12 PM
I think everyone has missed the point.

If you (or your daughter) has received an email from someone threatening their or anyone elses life, and you suspect it is not a hoax (ie from someone you know) then I wouldn't stuff around like this, and I would contact the local police ASAP and let them know the situation so they can check it out for you. Often, a message is a cry for attention and a wish to be stopped. Do nothing and the person may go through with it. Do something and you may save their life.

For christs sake call the cops! If he is not serious, then he will get a stern telling off. If he is well...

G P

I don't beleive you guys - who cares if it is actually possible to autosend when the subject is this???

~42~
02-10-2002, 02:18 PM
Pauline;
There is not a huge amount you can do for your daughters aquaintance unless you have some other form of communucation with him or a friend of his. ie fax, phone .....
threats of suicide should always be taken seriously.
If possible connect him with a professional person besause they are able to determine wether it is a genuine threat. Suicidal people often feel thast way because they believe/percieve they have noone to turn to or who understands. Often another person is blamed [your daughter in this case]. Your daugher should not feel guilty [but possibly will]

This forum is not really the place to continue this subject; I suggest you make contact with the mental health team in you area they will be able to give you more/better advice than myself

Hope it turns to nothing but a bad day for your daughters friend.
regards ~42~

Billy T
02-10-2002, 02:25 PM
Listen Pauline

The answer is simple. If you are genuinely concerned about this person, stop fussing about Hotmail and the hows, wheres, whyfores and maybes.

Take positive action.

I assume you or your daugther know his name, hotmail address, mailing or residential address, ISP (for tracing phone number) Stae if residence or whatever.

Pass this on immdiately to the NZ Police who will contact their counterparts in OZ.

If he's a drama queen who didn't mean it he's in for an almighty shock for wasting Police time on both sides of the ditch, and if he's serious you might save his life.

Don't pussyfoot around on Press F1 if you genuinely believe he could harm himself as his chosen method could well cost others their lives.

Get to it lady.

Billy T

Lohsing
02-10-2002, 02:50 PM
Geez... that's not good... ummm... does he not have friends overseas? It is a pretty sick threat if you ask me... Can you not call the police over there and ask them to pay him a visit??

Lo.

Chilling_Silence
02-10-2002, 04:10 PM
In the true spirit of Testers, I decided to make a new Hotmail (I needed a new one anyways...)
and send myself 2 messages from my old account at the same time. Both with the subject test and the actual body saying text.

Sending both at the same time i decided to see what the differene in headers etc. was!
This is what I got:


Received: from 210.48.100.22 by lw11fd.law11.hotmail.msn.com with HTTP;
Wed, 02 Oct 2002 03:03:09 GMT
X-Originating-IP: [210.xxx.100.22]
From: "Chilling_Silence" <xxxxxxxx@hotmail.com>
To: xxxxxxxx@hotmail.com
Subject: test
Date: Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:03:09 +1200
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/html
X-Stn-Info:

<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV>test</DIV></div></html>


and also:



Message-ID: <20021002030307.3xd9a61eb1ebe0@hotmail.com>
X-Originating-IP: [210.xxx.100.22]
From: "Chilling_Silence" <xxxxxxxx@hotmail.com>
To: <xxxxxxxxx@hotmail.com>
Subject: test
Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2002 15:02:28 +1200
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C26A24.B95900E0"
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C26A24.B95900E0
Content-Type: text/plain;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

test

------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C26A24.B95900E0
Content-Type: text/html;
charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2600.0" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>test</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C26A24.B95900E0--

So you were only too right.

Interesting though....

Pauline
02-10-2002, 08:51 PM
Thanks for all the comments. Sorry not to have posted anything sooner but in the end I had to get in touch with Interpol. It is in their hands now. Not sure if they will let me know the outcome with the privacy act.
Thanks anyway.
Pauline.

Brendonny
02-10-2002, 11:03 PM
you can set up many programs so send and receive through your hotmail account - incredimail, outlook etc. I send e-mails through my hotmail account so I would guess that they would go through and pick up the hotmail IP wouldn't they?? I'll try it now!!!

Billy T
03-10-2002, 12:18 AM
I can't believe that some of you guys are still treating this thread like an academic exercise in Hotmail manipulation.

In my personal opinion your actions are in very very very bad taste so how about starting another thread away from this one and taking your interest wih you.

Either that, or perhaps you could lock it Bruce?

Billy T

Chris Wilson
03-10-2002, 12:29 AM
Is it bad taste to answer a question?

Perhaps, but it was a question, it is resonable to assume an answer is required.

I'm personally not responcible for the life and well being of the planet, but i am interested in finding out if hotmail could have been used in this way for this guilt trip or not.

Perhaps this question is academic, but the answer seems worth knowing for very real reasons too.

Chris.

Billy T
03-10-2002, 10:21 AM
I don't disagree with your academic pursuit Chris, but please take the discussion away from this thread. It did in fact shift at one stage, but most people ignored the new thread and stayed on this one.

No, you are not 100% personally responsible for the life and wellbeing of the planet, and nobody is asking you to assume such an onerous load, however you do indeed carry your personal share of that responsibility.

Just show some good taste and sensitivity. It may yet be a hoax, but regardless, posters will be judged by their peers in accordance with their response to what was a potentially tragic situation.

Some posters may be found wanting.

Billy T

Graham Petrie
03-10-2002, 12:19 PM
I agree whole heartedly with you Billy. If you look back up the pots you will see that when I posted, noone had even stopped to think about the poor soul who pushed the send button. I was horrified at the blasé reaction from some of the posters.

Pauline, I hope things work out.

Discussion over perhaps???

G P

Lohsing
03-10-2002, 12:53 PM
Agreed... after the initial response early on, I'm a bit disappointed some ppl went through the exercise of trying to trace an email without realising that someone's life was at stake here.

I do hope things sort themselves out, Pauline.

Lo.

PS. I second the notion of locking this thread.

Biggles
03-10-2002, 02:01 PM
Yes agreed, although frankly it took me a while to twig to what was at the root of this from simply skimming the thread. Anyone not reading the beginning carefully would consider it a simple technical discussion, so let's not be too harsh on people for pursuing that. I don't see that it requires locking but it may well be time to carry on the technical discussion elsewhere.