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Cicero
30-09-2014, 06:06 PM
They have just installed water meters here in Waikanae.

1st bill is $53 for 50 days.

I am told the charge prior to meters was $250 a year.

Nice little earner if you are a council.

R2x1
30-09-2014, 06:18 PM
Even better if you are a company that bought the water distribution asset cheap. (As in Papakura.)
Watch to see how voiding the previous water rate drops your rates next year.


:tui:

Cicero
30-09-2014, 06:36 PM
I would like to see an audit on some of these councils.

Terry Porritt
30-09-2014, 07:05 PM
The water supply to Waikanae and the Kapiti area has been dodgy and of poor quality for years. It has been made worse and pressure put on the supply by all the retirees like yourself that have flooded into the area in recent years :rolleyes:

There has been a proposal to extract water from the Otaki River, but if memory serves me right there was opposition from the greenies !

Cicero
30-09-2014, 08:02 PM
The water supply to Waikanae and the Kapiti area has been dodgy and of poor quality for years. It has been made worse and pressure put on the supply by all the retirees like yourself that have flooded into the area in recent years :rolleyes:

There has been a proposal to extract water from the Otaki River, but if memory serves me right there was opposition from the greenies !
Alas the greenies are against everything.As the man said, let the bastds freeze in the dark.

Paul.Cov
30-09-2014, 09:18 PM
Less than $300 for a full years consumption in my area. We've been metred for 20 years or more.

paulw
30-09-2014, 09:45 PM
They have just installed water meters here in Waikanae.

1st bill is $53 for 50 days.

I am told the charge prior to meters was $250 a year.

Nice little earner if you are a council.

Sounds close the the rip off price I pay here in Auckland. About $35 / month. My M-in-law pays that for 3 months in Tauranga..

Cicero
01-10-2014, 04:33 AM
Sounds close the the rip off price I pay here in Auckland. About $35 / month. My M-in-law pays that for 3 months in Tauranga..
Somebody has to pay for the grand designs of your mayor.

kenj
01-10-2014, 06:30 AM
What's a water meter? :) Never heard of them in Napier.

Ken :)

pctek
01-10-2014, 07:33 AM
Everyone will be getting them.
Here in Auckland it used to be a fixed charge on the rates but now Watercare (owned by the council) have changed it.
$190 yearly fee + $1/34 a kl for water in, $2.34 a kl out. Actually it's gone up recently, can't remember the new charges.

If you get a water tank you are meant to tell them so they can charge you a flat rate of $500 or so a year for water out.


My bill averages $75 a month. It is high, but that's because of the amount of garden watering we do over summer - and it's a lot, so I pay the bill this way now rather than have a $40 bill then $140 bill type thing depending what month it is.

Sons bill is around $50 all the time.

pctek
01-10-2014, 07:33 AM
What's a water meter? :) Never heard of them in Napier.

Ken :)

You're next you know....or didn't you?

Terry Porritt
01-10-2014, 07:50 AM
Kapiti really have a major problem with their water supply. The Waikanae river is just not big enough, the Otaki is probably the only other option.

Periodically in the local Upper Hutt paper we read about their troubles and the vile tasting water.

Quote: "The introduction of water meters will lead to a drop in water use, therefore reducing the cost of upgrading/maintaining our water supply, extending its life-time and delaying any upgrades." It is in the too hard basket...

All about the meters here:
http://www.kapiticoast.govt.nz/Your-Council/A---Z-Council-Services-and-Facilities/rates/Water-Rates/CRAG/CRAG-FAQs/

kenj
01-10-2014, 08:31 AM
You're next you know....or didn't you?

Just kidding :) Seriously, most properties in Napier don't have a water meter. I think that new houses and repairs are having them fitted. It has been discussed by the council but from what I can gather, the cost of fitting all homes with a meter is prohibitive and a fairly lengthy process. Our water supply all comes from a huge aquifer under Hawkes Bay, so much water that there is a huge freshwater spring out to sea off Napier. Great place to catch large Schnapper I am told :)

Keeping our fingers crossed

Ken :thumbs:

paulw
01-10-2014, 08:35 AM
Just kidding :) Seriously, most properties in Napier don't have a water meter. I think that new houses and repairs are having them fitted. It has been discussed by the council but from what I can gather, the cost of fitting all homes with a meter is prohibitive and a fairly lengthy process. Our water supply all comes from a huge aquifer under Hawkes Bay, so much water that there is a huge freshwater spring out to sea off Napier. Great place to catch large Schnapper I am told :)

Keeping our fingers crossed

Ken :thumbs:

"the cost of fitting all homes with a meter is prohibitive" don't you believe it. The council will not worry about the cost , they'll just pass it on to the end user..

Marnie
01-10-2014, 09:12 AM
Water!! The most valuable mineral in the world. Try living without it.

kenj
01-10-2014, 09:15 AM
Ban all chemicals... Hydrogen Dioxide (Ooops, anyone like to correct this) Di-Hydrogen Oxide maybe?

Ken :)

1101
01-10-2014, 09:40 AM
Its about making profits. Its not about covering actual costs
Expect water bills to just keep going up & up & up (no competition)

Terry Porritt
01-10-2014, 10:31 AM
Its about making profits. Its not about covering actual costs
Expect water bills to just keep going up & up & up (no competition)

That is certainly what you get when water supply is privatised, no doubt about it.

dugimodo
01-10-2014, 10:34 AM
Water!! The most valuable mineral in the world. Try living without it.
Valuable quite possibly, but a mineral? nope

From wikipedia

A mineral is a naturally occurring substance that is solid and inorganic representable by a chemical formula, usually abiogenic, and has an ordered atomic structure.

Nit picking urge for the day satisfied :)

Marnie
01-10-2014, 10:38 AM
Valuable quite possibly, but a mineral? nope

From wikipedia


Nit picking urge for the day satisfied :)

It's one of those marginal things, but I am happy to be corrected on a technicality.

1101
01-10-2014, 10:47 AM
Valuable quite possibly, but a mineral? nope


It is a mineral in the form of Ice or snow.

Tap water(and 'natural' water) has so many chemicals in it, it should be called mineral water
:D

Cicero
01-10-2014, 11:08 AM
Kapiti really have a major problem with their water supply. The Waikanae river is just not big enough, the Otaki is probably the only other option.

Periodically in the local Upper Hutt paper we read about their troubles and the vile tasting water.

Quote: "The introduction of water meters will lead to a drop in water use, therefore reducing the cost of upgrading/maintaining our water supply, extending its life-time and delaying any upgrades." It is in the too hard basket...

All about the meters here:
http://www.kapiticoast.govt.nz/Your-Council/A---Z-Council-Services-and-Facilities/rates/Water-Rates/CRAG/CRAG-FAQs/

Thanks for that Terr.

You will note they say no privatization here.

paulw
01-10-2014, 12:33 PM
That is certainly what you get when water supply is privatised, no doubt about it.

Don't know on any water supply in NZ that has been privatized.. It's all still council owned and operated..

Cicero
01-10-2014, 01:04 PM
Don't know on any water supply in NZ that has been privatized.. It's all still council owned and operated..
Terr is a bit of a lefty, so all is seen as waiting to attack the proletariat.

Terry Porritt
01-10-2014, 03:01 PM
Don't know on any water supply in NZ that has been privatized.. It's all still council owned and operated..

UK yesterday, NZ tomorrow.

Quote:
Water privatisation in England and Wales remains controversial. A 2001 study by the Public Services International Research Unit stated that
tariffs increased by 46% in real terms during the first nine years,
operating profits have more than doubled (+142%) in eight years,
investments were reduced and
public health was jeopardised through cut-offs for non-payment, however, this was made illegal in 1998 along with prepayment meters and 'trickle valves'.[2]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_privatisation_in_England_and_Wales

The Business Round Table campaigned furiously for privatisation of the Wellington Regional Council water supply in the days when Stuart Macaskill was chairman of the GWRC, and Roger Kerr was Executive Director of the BRT. Fortunately they did not prevail.

pctek
01-10-2014, 04:32 PM
J I think that new houses and repairs are having them fitted. It has been discussed by the council but from what I can gather, the cost of fitting all homes with a meter is prohibitive and a fairly lengthy process. O

http://www.waterforce.co.nz/View_News.php?id=4


When we were down Wyndham we had ore water. Most people did, some had tanks.
Then......we were required to pay $10,000 + to be connected to town water (to the gate - to the house we had to come up with plumbers and more money ourselves), all houses got meters installed. The $10,000 could be paid up front or added (with interest to the rates over so many years)
They hadn't started charging when we left....but wait for it.

It's a govt thing so everyone will sooner or later.
Huntly is getting them right now.
Otaki apparently is too I heard.

Paul.Cov
01-10-2014, 05:28 PM
Everyone will be getting them.
$190 yearly fee + $1/34 a kl for water in, $2.34 a kl out. Actually it's gone up recently, can't remember the new charges.


Am I correct in thinking you're describing a charge for water that is discharged?

Is this sewer water / grey water / rain water off the roof they're measuring? How are they metering it?

paulw
01-10-2014, 06:54 PM
Am I correct in thinking you're describing a charge for water that is discharged?

Is this sewer water / grey water / rain water off the roof they're measuring? How are they metering it?

It's based on a percentage of what goes in..

pctek
02-10-2014, 07:52 AM
Am I correct in thinking you're describing a charge for water that is discharged?

Is this sewer water / grey water / rain water off the roof they're measuring? How are they metering it?

From their website:

In 2014-2015, the price of water is $1.375 per 1,000 litres. And for householders the cost of wastewater services is $2.336 per 1,000 litres plus a $195 annual fixed charge. Customers connected to the public wastewater system but with their own water supply pay a fixed annual charge of $596.

It costs more to collect and treat wastewater, and this difference is reflected in our charges.

The wastewater charge is calculated at 78% of what water coming in is used - they say this is how much of it goes back down the drain.
Plus there is the annual fixed charge.

Tank owners get stuck with $596 as they are putting it down the drain too (apparently).

BBCmicro
02-10-2014, 05:59 PM
From their website:...is $2.336 per 1,000 litres

Why do they still quote volume in litres rather than cubic metres! What's wrong with "per cu-m" instead of per 1000 litres (or 1,000,000 cc or whatever)?

Reminds me of the days of "3000 kB" instead of 3 MB

kahawai chaser
02-10-2014, 07:57 PM
Why do they still quote volume in litres rather than cubic metres! What's wrong with "per cu-m" instead of per 1000 litres (or 1,000,000 cc or whatever)?

Reminds me of the days of "3000 kB" instead of 3 MB

Good question - But litres pertain generally to liquids (volume), that can be held, poured or flowed out. Whether if copious volumes of water supply or pouring from a 1.5 litre of coke. Most people can visualize (and readily know about litres) small to mid size volumes (in litres), compared to cubic meters, which not as common I suppose in everyday use. Litres for liquids, cubic meters for....hard to quickly relate readily to anything...

Though cu-m pertain generally relates to dimensional (and seems to be more in industrial use) volume space - (e.g. engine size, warehouse storage, coolstore size, industrial bins, etc)- generally without any form of liquid involved. Historical terminology/nomenclature I think.

R2x1
02-10-2014, 09:52 PM
Why do they still quote volume in litres rather than cubic metres! What's wrong with "per cu-m" instead of per 1000 litres (or 1,000,000 cc or whatever)?

Reminds me of the days of "3000 kB" instead of 3 MB

Perhaps you could fund some consultants and programmers to write a program to convert 1,000s of Litres to M^3
(Providing Apple hasn't copyrighted the formula.) ;)

pctek
03-10-2014, 07:28 AM
Probably because that's how the meters record it.

And most things like the washing machine, taps, toilets are measured in litres.

BBCmicro
03-10-2014, 01:59 PM
River flows are measured in cubic metres per second ('cumecs')

I used to live near the Waikanae river and have a feeling for 1 cumec because that was about the minimum allowed flow. It's not much. Most people would see it as just a stream

A cubic metre of water weighs a tonne and a truck can carry 5 to 10 tons... easy to visualise

Ocean currents are measured in cubic kilometres - it's a bit harder to visualise those!