PDA

View Full Version : The moment now.



Cicero
30-03-2011, 07:01 PM
Do we agree with this?.............


There is only ONE moment happening ever. A past moment does not actually exist anywhere in reality; the only place the past moment can possibly exist is in the memory. Likewise, it is impossible for a future moment to exist anywhere other than the brain that ponders it. Therefore the now moment is the only moment that actually exists, all else is illusiory.

Snorkbox
30-03-2011, 07:09 PM
Mostly I agree. However, if a past moment is recorded, it can be replayed.

So if I'm watching a recorded moment at the moment it exists for me at the moment. :)

ubergeek85
30-03-2011, 07:23 PM
In other words, there is no then, only now.

Cicero
30-03-2011, 07:30 PM
Mostly I agree. However, if a past moment is recorded, it can be replayed.

So if I'm watching a recorded moment at the moment it exists for me at the moment. :)

Which is precisely what it says, there is only now.

Do you agree Uber?

ubergeek85
30-03-2011, 07:34 PM
Yes, but I condensed it down to six words.

tuiruru
30-03-2011, 07:47 PM
So is your conceptual model of "the notion of now" digital or analogue in nature?

fred_fish
30-03-2011, 07:52 PM
Do we agree with this?.............
No.
That is equivalent to saying that only one place exists.
If you can only ever experience "here", then "there" is, by that logic, nonexistent.

All places & times exist simultaneously, but your "moment" is entirely subjective and depends on the particular space-time co-ordinates occupied by the observer.

:waughh:

--Wolf--
30-03-2011, 08:08 PM
If you want something to ponder how about this....

Everything happens to you. In a way the world revolves around you.

Snippet:

9. “I”
Become aware of the fact that your world always includes you. As William James
noted, it is I see, I hear, I feel, I think that is the basic fact of experience.5 You are not
what you see, hear, think, or feel; you have these experiences. Perhaps most
essentially, you are who is aware. You are always at the center of your
multidimensional universe of experience, but you are not always consciously aware of
yourself. Briefly repeat the exercise with the following difference: At the same time
you attend to each of the various aspects of your experience, be aware that it is you
who is noticing these things (“I see the light...”). (link (http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/archivos_pdf/exploring_luciddreaming.pdf))

Basically if you don't see/hear/feel etc then essentially it doesn't happen, well that's the way I see it anyway which might not actually be interpreted right, but might be worth trying the exercise in the link. Interesting way to view life too, that it's your world and everyone else is just put into it.

zqwerty
30-03-2011, 09:03 PM
Time


When I was young, I dreamed,
Often a dream about flying,
Flying along about head height above the ground,
Moving smoothly and effortlessly, gliding
As in a dream.
Astral travelling.
A cruise missile, ground hugging.
As I got older I stopped dreaming that dream
I almost forgot that I had ever dreamt it
But when I broke my leg in the middle of my life,
I remembered it again.
I started to ride a bicycle to strengthen my withered, wasted leg
And the dream became reality.
Today even, riding along on a sunny afternoon
With a warm nor-westerly breeze at my heels
Effortlessly, moving quite fast
Always at the same height
I relive my childhood.
These days, however, I think of deeper things
Time does not exist in and of itself.
16/9/3

Cicero
30-03-2011, 09:08 PM
Time does not exist in and of itself.

The moment exists.

Now

The Error Guy
30-03-2011, 09:08 PM
If you record a moment then it would be a copy of the moment but it would be only from one perspective unless you can recored the happenings of everything in the universe down to below sub atomic level at that precise moment

zqwerty
30-03-2011, 09:12 PM
COP OUT


Ancestry inevitability

Inimitable

Cloaked in web-like

Secrecy

The truth shall be lost

For the greater -zygote

Magic messages

Sent along the genetical lines

Coding backwaters

Of mudslips

Survival of the fittest

Supposedly

Chaotic beings -

Ritualized into societies

Feed on belief systems

Of our impeccability and faultlessness

This is full of fundamental flaws

The floorboards are rotting

Sacrificial sentimentality

of bygone generations

At least five generations back

Will be affecting us now

So where is free-will

And choice?

Poppa John
30-03-2011, 09:54 PM
No.
That is equivalent to saying that only one place exists.
If you can only ever experience "here", then "there" is, by that logic, nonexistent.

All places & times exist simultaneously, but your "moment" is entirely subjective and depends on the particular space-time co-ordinates occupied by the observer.

:waughh:


I think Dr Who already said that. Or was it Dr Spok? PJ:lol:

pine-o-cleen
30-03-2011, 10:22 PM
Who decided it was possible to record a moment?

I hypothesize that a moment can not be recorded.

ubergeek85
30-03-2011, 10:23 PM
My cellphone has other ideas

pine-o-cleen
30-03-2011, 10:34 PM
You're not recording a moment. You're recording video.

Agent_24
30-03-2011, 10:39 PM
I have nothing to say and I am saying it and that is poetry.
-John Cage

Winston001
30-03-2011, 10:51 PM
Does a wise man like yourself really need an answer Cic?

You may want to consider Renee Descartes - "I think therefore I am" ergo we only exist because you want us to. I'm flattered. :D

Or the Copenhagen Interpretation much favoured by Einstein and Nils Bohr which supports your hypothesis. Sort of. For you, the subjective observer, this moment exists for you in local time. You cannot know what is happening elsewhere.

Or...the Many Worlds interpretation which says that your "moment" exists across a multitude of universes and therefore cannot be alone.

Hopefully Terry will come along and put us straight.

Cicero
31-03-2011, 08:04 AM
We try to answer this question from the outside, where the answer I think comes from the inside, from contemplating the idea.

This woman gets a glimpse, for me, you have to leave out the noise at the end.

http://goo.gl/cqRuu

The Error Guy
31-03-2011, 08:15 AM
You're not recording a moment. You're recording video.

Well recording from a single perspective in reduced quality the reflected wavelengths of light from pure energy in the visible wavelength

So its like taking a pixel and saying its an accurate interpretation of the entire screen

Richard
31-03-2011, 09:11 AM
What have you guys been on??

Cicero
31-03-2011, 09:26 AM
The tendency is to look outside ourselves for the answer, where as I think the answer might be from the inside.

Sorry Richard, but we will do comics next week,ok?

Metla
31-03-2011, 09:30 AM
How do you define a moment?

:pf1mobmini:

johcar
31-03-2011, 09:31 AM
Lots of quotes from some very well-known people here!

So here's my contribution:

"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so."

- Ford Prefect (Douglas Adams)

fred_fish
31-03-2011, 09:52 AM
... the answer might be from the inside.

Sorry Richard, but we will do comics next week,ok?

http://xkcd.com/876/

Snorkbox
31-03-2011, 10:00 AM
How do you define a moment?

:pf1mobmini:

Very good question there.

A moment in history could be several years as in World War 2.

A Moment is normally defined as a brief period of time and considering all the history we have accumulated to date the years between 1939 and 1945 occupy a relatively brief part.

kenj
31-03-2011, 10:23 AM
A moment....hmmmn

A moment is half the time required to do a panic run to the loo after a feed of hot chilli?

Ken ;)

johcar
31-03-2011, 10:30 AM
Very good question there.

A moment in history could be several years as in World War 2.

A Moment is normally defined as a brief period of time and considering all the history we have accumulated to date the years between 1939 and 1945 occupy a relatively brief part.

A medieval unit of time equal to 1/40 hour or 1.5 minutes. This meaning has come down to us only as "a brief interval of time." The moment was divided into 12 ounces of 7.5 seconds each.

Link (http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/units/dictM.html). (You'll need to scroll a bit...)

Also defined as: "A moment is exactly half the length of a piece of string."

MAC_H8ER
31-03-2011, 10:37 AM
the next time the boss says to me "can i have a moment?" im gonna say "NO! YOU CANT HAVE ONE!" and throw a tanty

Snorkbox
31-03-2011, 10:41 AM
A medieval unit of time equal to 1/40 hour or 1.5 minutes. This meaning has come down to us only as "a brief interval of time." The moment was divided into 12 ounces of 7.5 seconds each.

Link (http://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/units/dictM.html). (You'll need to scroll a bit...)

Also defined as: "A moment is exactly half the length of a piece of string."

As it happens I learnt that a moment was once 1.5 minutes.

I'll be back in half a mo'. :) Maybe.

Bobh
31-03-2011, 11:49 AM
I think that moments only exist in time whether it is the past, the present or the future. We have fuller control of what happens at this moment but past moments only exist in the memory. Things that happened in the past cannot be undone but can be remedied in the future. Future moments can be influenced by how we have acted in the past or in the present moment.

Gobe1
31-03-2011, 11:51 AM
Havent you seen or heard of the langoliers?
"The Langoliers are the timekeepers of eternity, and that their purpose is to eat what is left of the past" wikipedia

Bobh
31-03-2011, 02:00 PM
Havent you seen or heard of the langoliers?
"The Langoliers are the timekeepers of eternity, and that their purpose is to eat what is left of the past" wikipedia

Sounds scary to me. A science fiction movie that could be interesting to watch no doubt.

Cicero
31-03-2011, 02:12 PM
How do you define a moment?

:pf1mobmini:

That time between the past and the future, not an easy question, because, we find it just about impossible to live it, the closest one can get I think is when we meditate..

You might ask what is the point of that, I can only say that if practised in a good environment, you can get the sense of it, and it is rather nice.

Richard
31-03-2011, 03:46 PM
Is that the sensation I get at the beach, when I have my post-lunch snooze after my couple of pre-lunch beers, and sort of half listen to the cricket. If that isn't 'now' I don't know what is. Drifting away like a butterfly on a warm breeze!

zqwerty
31-03-2011, 04:09 PM
If there is no intelligent observer does time exist, or, what would be here if you were not.

If a tree falls over in a forest and there is no-one there does it make a sound?

If the Wizard falls over in the square and there is no audience does he make a sound?

Snorkbox
31-03-2011, 04:18 PM
If there is no intelligent observer does time exist, or, what would be here if you were not.

If a tree falls over in a forest and there is no-one there does it make a noise?

If the Wizard falls over in the square and there is no audience does he make a sound?

Time itself is a man made conception.

Correct me if I'm wrong but it was man who made several calendars including Mayan, Gregorian etc.

Bit like asking "How long is that in Dog years."

zqwerty
31-03-2011, 04:20 PM
I know the answers, just seeing if anyone else has a clue.

Snorkbox
31-03-2011, 04:21 PM
:devil

Billy T
31-03-2011, 05:52 PM
Today is the tomorrow we talked about yesterday, and you are the them that they were discussing.

Time and reality are a movable feast..............

Cheers

Billy 8-{)

The only constant is Monday Laughs,

until it stops...

rob_on_guitar
31-03-2011, 05:57 PM
You been drinking moonshine Cicy?

Cicero
31-03-2011, 06:51 PM
You been drinking moonshine Cicy?

You can experience the moment when the guitar seems to be playing itself, no doubt not something you would experience very often Rob.

Richard, what you experience is a sleeping state, we are talking of awareness.

sarel
01-04-2011, 07:41 AM
I agree that all you deep thinkers haven't been taking your medicine lately ...............

sarel

tuiruru
01-04-2011, 08:53 AM
If there is no intelligent observer does time exist, or, what would be here if you were not.

If a tree falls over in a forest and there is no-one there does it make a sound?

If the Wizard falls over in the square and there is no audience does he make a sound?

If a man says something in a forest and there is no one there to here him, is he still wrong? - a woman asked me that!

tuiruru
01-04-2011, 08:56 AM
I think that moments only exist in time whether it is the past, the present or the future. We have fuller control of what happens at this moment but past moments only exist in the memory. Things that happened in the past cannot be undone but can be remedied in the future. Future moments can be influenced by how we have acted in the past or in the present moment.

In A level Applied Maths and Physics we used to take moments about a point. Before we did that we asked ourselves "Is it my turn now?"

Bobh
01-04-2011, 08:57 AM
I agree that all you deep thinkers haven't been taking your medicine lately ...............

sarel

Nothing wrong with deep thinking but it can be distractive.

WalOne
01-04-2011, 09:07 AM
If a man says something in a forest and there is no one there to here him, is he still wrong? - a woman asked me that!

This thread is getting more and more obtuse. :devil

Cicero
01-04-2011, 09:17 AM
Does a wise man like yourself really need an answer Cic?

Far from wise I am afraid 007.

It is not uncommon for people to experience living in the moment, be it driving a bulldozer, when evertything is in harmony,running a race and feeling it is no effort, or playing an instrument etc and finding it effortless.

Then again maybe not.

tuiruru
01-04-2011, 09:43 AM
If a man says something in a forest and there is no one there to here him, is he still wrong? - a woman asked me that!
That was a typo Wal so thanks for that, but if we leave it as "here", making it a verb ie to place him in the moment, does that make it existentialist enough for you?

rob_on_guitar
01-04-2011, 10:29 AM
So you can never have now, you just live in the past?
Urgh..... brain needs plaster, I got the dumb!

WalOne
01-04-2011, 11:41 AM
That was a typo Wal so thanks for that, but if we leave it as "here", making it a verb ie to place him in the moment, does that make it existentialist enough for you?

I was really doing nothing except being mischievous re the typo (you have to admit it - the typo - gave an entirely different meaning to your words). :D

However, I think you may be applying the wrong label (existentialism) to the thread. Although I haven't followed it (the thread) in any detail, in my understanding it's not about existentialism. Unless I'm missing something? :horrified

Renmoo
03-04-2011, 08:55 AM
Another thought:

Want to know how death feels like? Try sleeping.

Cicero
04-04-2011, 10:23 AM
Another thought:

Want to know how death feels like? Try sleeping.

Are we talking the big sleep or the overnight jobbie?

Billy T
04-04-2011, 10:53 AM
If there is no intelligent observer does time exist, or, what would be here if you were not.

(1) If I leave my office, it continues to exist in space and time. The first is proven by the increase in my unanswered email items and the second by its continued nagging presence on my return.


If a tree falls over in a forest and there is no-one there does it make a sound?

(2) Yes. Sound is simply pressure variations in the air (hence no sound in a vacuum). Sound exists whether we are present to hear it or not.


If the Wizard falls over in the square and there is no audience does he make a sound?

(3) See 2

If you want to be profound zqwerty, you'll have to do better than that. :D

Time is universal, in the deeper meaning of the word, so on the scale of the universe, the presence or absence of mankind is infinitesimally small and thus totally insignificant. Time would still exist, though perhaps unmeasured.

Cheers

Billy 8-{)

zqwerty
04-04-2011, 12:40 PM
You are wrong Billy T time only exists when there is an intelligent observer and is an invention of that observer in an attempt to make sense of things.

Time is a concept not a reality.

As to the sound vs noise question, it is an observer that notices the sound of the noise if there is no observer then the event does happen but no sound is heard.

The Wizard question was a joke, and a very funny one too if you have ever been around the Wizard for any length of time observing him.

Cicero
04-04-2011, 02:51 PM
You may find this amusing, double click on image, camera is 1500 mp.

http://goo.gl/bDT6