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View Full Version : Immigrant language rules dropped ?



Digby
29-07-2009, 09:24 PM
Hi Guys,

You are probably aware that National are dropping the English language requirements for business investors that bring in $10 million.

I don't have too much problem with that as I believe we need more people here. But I would like to know what checks and balances there will be on this.

Eg what sort of businesses will they set up - useful export businesses that employ kiwis and bring in overseas funds ? or Trademe type importers that bring in Chinese trinkets ? or Asian tourist businesses that cater to their own.

Also what measures to stop the money going back out again - ala the schemes that that Delamere ex-Immigration minister set up.

somebody
29-07-2009, 09:30 PM
Hi Guys,

You are probably aware that National are dropping the English language requirements for business investors that bring in $10 million.

I don't have too much problem with that as I believe we need more people here. But I would like to know what checks and balances there will be on this.

Eg what sort of businesses will they set up - useful export businesses that employ kiwis and bring in overseas funds ? or Trademe type importers that bring in Chinese trinkets ? or Asian tourist businesses that cater to their own.

Also what measures to stop the money going back out again - ala the schemes that that Delamere ex-Immigration minister set up.

How many millionaires are there trying to get into this country, who otherwise wouldn't qualify under other avenues anyway? My guess is that we will maybe have up to 50 people coming in a year under this scheme.

Even we were suddenly inundated by millionaires, any impact they have will likely be positive - if they just come here to retire, they'll be spending money here. Likewise, if they set up a "Trademe type importers", they'll be creating work for courier companies and so on; catering to tourists means more money for local operators, more GST collected, and so on.

Like you, I'm not really fussed. The overall impact will be minimal in the greater scheme of things - unless there aren't checks in place to prevent the Delamere type scams.

R2x1
29-07-2009, 09:33 PM
I believe NZ is overpopulated now. Axe a few sods, starting with Bellamy's clientele, and then we could discuss the Mercedes migrant schemes.

If you succeeded in stopping the dodgy scams, the unemploted lawyers would be even more of a drain on the public purse than they are now. Well, maybe not.

Cato
29-07-2009, 09:34 PM
This kind of system exists almost everywhere else. In Austria you can very easily gain citizenship if you invest 1million euro into a local business. Otherwise "permenant" immigration is nearly impossible. I believe they have a requirement for german, however.

I guess money speaks louder than words. :)


Edit: Do you think millionaire Joe is going to waste his time talking to any of us? He'll be in NZ all of three days a year (once his citizenship criteria have been met). But a New Zealand passport is much better than say a Chinese one (does China allow multiple citizenships??) unless he wants to trade with North Korea.

somebody
29-07-2009, 09:38 PM
This kind of system exists almost everywhere else. In Austria you can very easily gain citizenship if you invest 1million euro into a local business. Otherwise "permenant" immigration is nearly impossible. I believe they have a requirement for german, however.

I guess money speaks louder than words. :)

I think there's a useful differentiation between residency and citizenship. Since the plan is to grant them residency, it doesn't bother me too much (as they won't be able to get a NZ passport, and so on). Citizenship is another matter - people shouldn't be given it just because they have money - but that isn't what they're planning to do.

Cato
29-07-2009, 09:41 PM
What is the REAL criteria for citizenship in NZ?

My friend's mother speaks two word of english. "Hello" and "Bye". Still got citizenship. Been in NZ well over 10 years. Citizens for much of that time.

somebody
29-07-2009, 09:43 PM
What is the REAL criteria for citizenship in NZ?

My friend's mother speaks two word of english. "Hello" and "Bye". Still got citizenship. Been in NZ well over 10 years. Citizens for much of that time.

According to the DIA website: http://www.dia.govt.nz/diawebsite.nsf/wpg_URL/Services-Citizenship-Requirements-for-New-Zealand-Citizenship?OpenDocument


To be granted New Zealand citizenship you must meet the requirements of either the Citizenship Act 1977 or the Citizenship Act (Western Samoa) 1982. You may be eligible for a grant of New Zealand citizenship if you:

* Intend, if granted citizenship, to continue to reside in New Zealand,
* Are able to understand and speak English,
* Are of good character,
* Understand the responsibilities and privileges of New Zealand citizenship,
* Are a permanent resident of New Zealand; and

EITHER

1. You received your permanent residence before 21 April 2005, and
2. Have been ordinarily resident in New Zealand for the last 3 years.

OR

1. You have received your permanent residence on or after 21 April 2005, and
2. Have had your New Zealand permanent residence for the last 5 years.

For further information see General Requirements for a Grant of New Zealand Citizenship.

hueybot3000
29-07-2009, 09:45 PM
What is the REAL criteria for citizenship in NZ?

My friend's mother speaks two word of english. "Hello" and "Bye". Still got citizenship. Been in NZ well over 10 years. Citizens for much of that time.

How do you spend that much time in NZ and not pick up the language? Unless they're lucky enough to be lounging out on some huge lifestyle block

Cato
29-07-2009, 10:01 PM
Somebody, surely you remember the influx of immigrants in NZ in the late 90s and their exit into Australia as soon as they had NZ citizenship?

R2x1
29-07-2009, 10:05 PM
OR

1. You have received your permanent residence on or after 21 April 2005, and
2. Have had your New Zealand permanent residence for the last 5 years.

That's a tricky one. ;)

somebody
29-07-2009, 10:39 PM
Somebody, surely you remember the influx of immigrants in NZ in the late 90s and their exit into Australia as soon as they had NZ citizenship?

Yup - the thing is in this particular case, they're not being granted citizenship - just residency. Therefore, they will not be given a NZ passport. Your suggestion for having a minimum investment in NZ sounds like a good idea, to make sure those coming here are genuine.

I'm not familiar with Australian immigration laws, however as far as I was aware, the special arrangement between NZ and Oz for relaxed migration only applies to citizens, rather than permanent residents.

bk T
29-07-2009, 11:02 PM
Eg what sort of businesses will they set up - useful export businesses that employ kiwis and bring in overseas funds ? or Trademe type importers that bring in Chinese trinkets ? or Asian tourist businesses that cater to their own.



Most likely Trademe type.:D What other business can be set up in NZ, if they can't speak proper English and the locals can't accept them?

If I'm not wrong, there are quite a number of Trademe 'traders' are those immigrants. Probably that's all they can do!

Cato
29-07-2009, 11:26 PM
Yup - the thing is in this particular case, they're not being granted citizenship - just residency. Therefore, they will not be given a NZ passport. Your suggestion for having a minimum investment in NZ sounds like a good idea, to make sure those coming here are genuine.

I'm not familiar with Australian immigration laws, however as far as I was aware, the special arrangement between NZ and Oz for relaxed migration only applies to citizens, rather than permanent residents.


Yes, but PR will lead to citizenship. A passport from a "first world" country is very valuable.

To the second point, yes, NZ citizens can jump over the ditch. However NZ PR holders can not, but I believe some time ago they could. Australian permanent residents, not only citizens, can be granted NZ PR if they so want.
It's a little Tasman double standard if you like. :)

Edit: I wanted to ask ya'll. To lead a normal life in NZ you don't really need citizenship, do you?
If you have PR you have most of the benefits of being citizens, free education, voting right, the benefit, student allowance, etc. Don’t you think people getting such privileges should at least learn the English language?

gary67
30-07-2009, 06:57 AM
Citizenship requires you to be in NZ for 2 years over a 3 year period once you have residency and to pay over a large sum of money, despite what they say it is that easy. I know I did it. The only advantage to getting citizenship is to get the passport, which then allows to you move to OZ if you so wish, apart from that residency covers everything else you can vote and work also you can go on the DPB

bk T
30-07-2009, 09:33 AM
... free education...

Is there such a thing in New Zealand?

There is even a 'Compulsory Donation' in Primary schools in NZ.

I do believe that all those present politicians in the beehive did receive 'Free' education but not the present students.

Poppa John
30-07-2009, 10:50 AM
What is the REAL criteria for citizenship in NZ?

My friend's mother speaks two word of english. "Hello" and "Bye". Still got citizenship. Been in NZ well over 10 years. Citizens for much of that time.

Sorry mate. But two words of English in 10 years? She ought to be ashamed of herself. If I lived in China for 10 years I would hopefully be fluent but with a Kiwi accent. PJ