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View Full Version : Roger McClay - was that fraud ?



Digby
17-08-2010, 08:09 AM
Obviously this case is a bit sad, as he seemed to have done a lot of good work.

But I wonder if the news media is correct in claiming this was a rip off ?

He charged the charities for flights.
I imagine he took the flights
I imagine that he charged the correct fare price (hope they checked)
The charities re-imbursed him

So how were the charities ripped off ?
If I had done that work for them they would have had to pay me the same amount they paid Roger McClay.
So how were they ripped off ?

Snorkbox
17-08-2010, 08:14 AM
Oh please Digby. He put in a Guilty plea and had other charges dropped.

He charged the TaxPayers and the Charities for the same travel expenses It's called double dipping.

See here:-
http://home.nzcity.co.nz/news/article.aspx?id=118632&fm=psp,tsf

PaulD
17-08-2010, 08:23 AM
Obviously this case is a bit sad, as he seemed to have done a lot of good work.

But I wonder if the news media is correct in claiming this was a rip off ?

He charged the charities for flights.
I imagine he took the flights
I imagine that he charged the correct fare price (hope they checked)
The charities re-imbursed him

So how were the charities ripped off ?


AFAIK he charged them the correct full fare but only paid the reduced fare available for ex MPs and kept the difference.

somebody
17-08-2010, 08:35 AM
AFAIK he charged them the correct full fare but only paid the reduced fare available for ex MPs and kept the difference.

Yup - he was entitled to a 90% discount as an ex-MP, so only paid 10% of the full fare yet invoiced the charities for 100%.

Gobe1
17-08-2010, 08:52 AM
Dont tradesmen do that with trade pricess???

Cicero
17-08-2010, 09:11 AM
Obviously this case is a bit sad, as he seemed to have done a lot of good work.

But I wonder if the news media is correct in claiming this was a rip off ?

He charged the charities for flights.
I imagine he took the flights
I imagine that he charged the correct fare price (hope they checked)
The charities re-imbursed him

So how were the charities ripped off ?
If I had done that work for them they would have had to pay me the same amount they paid Roger McClay.
So how were they ripped off ?

Remove your rose tints Dig.

Snorkbox
17-08-2010, 10:28 AM
Smacks of plea bargaining to avoid gaol time I would think.

qazwsxokmijn
17-08-2010, 11:02 AM
These politicians are no different to morons who deserve jail and/or death. Their actions are morally and ethically reprehensible! Here they are already receiving 6-figure salaries from the taxpayers and they STILL have this self-perceived 'right' to get free or heavily discounted first-class tickets anywhere, dine lavishly and splurge out on expensive fine wines.

Any other employee of any company would most likely be disciplined or even fired if they dined on half of what these pigs are dining on!

Cicero
17-08-2010, 11:51 AM
Smacks of plea bargaining to avoid gaol time I would think.

No flys on you Snorty!

Snorkbox
17-08-2010, 12:33 PM
No flys on you Snorty!

Probably not but I guess you may see where they have been. :-)

Cicero
17-08-2010, 12:46 PM
Probably not but I guess you may see where they have been. :-)

Dieldrin is good for fly blow!

SolMiester
17-08-2010, 01:22 PM
Yup - he was entitled to a 90% discount as an ex-MP, so only paid 10% of the full fare yet invoiced the charities for 100%.

Isnt that his bonus though, NOT the charities?

SolMiester
17-08-2010, 01:23 PM
Dont tradesmen do that with trade pricess???

Of course they do, no way do they pass on their discount....

Cicero
17-08-2010, 01:48 PM
Isnt that his bonus though, NOT the charities?

Quite right Solly,they should have given him a medal as well!

somebody
17-08-2010, 07:47 PM
Isnt that his bonus though, NOT the charities?

The reason it's fraud is he is fraudulently claiming that he spent xxx when seeking reimbursement. He's not on-selling a product or service, so the tradesperson analogy does not apply. I don't know about you, but if I put in an expense claim to my employer for 900% more than I paid for a work-related flight, I would be shown the door very promptly.

Either way, it's a charity for crying out loud. The dynamic is very different compared to if you were sellling goods or services to a company - with charities or other non-profit organisations, if you are in that sort of role you seek to be reimbursed for costs you've incurred, not make a 900% profit on it!

mikebartnz
17-08-2010, 11:25 PM
He charged the charities for flights.
I imagine he took the flights
I imagine that he charged the correct fare price (hope they checked)
The charities re-imbursed him
But the Govt had already paid for the flights so he should be hung, drawn and quartered.
He's as bad as those two judges a few years ago.

qazwsxokmijn
17-08-2010, 11:28 PM
But WE had already paid for the flights so he should be hung, drawn and quartered.
He's as bad as those two judges a few years ago.
Corrected.

Other than the correction, +1:thumbs:

Digby
18-08-2010, 07:43 AM
So he did not rip off the charities.
He ripped of the government ie us !

SolMiester
18-08-2010, 09:16 AM
The reason it's fraud is he is fraudulently claiming that he spent xxx when seeking reimbursement. He's not on-selling a product or service, so the tradesperson analogy does not apply. I don't know about you, but if I put in an expense claim to my employer for 900% more than I paid for a work-related flight, I would be shown the door very promptly.

Either way, it's a charity for crying out loud. The dynamic is very different compared to if you were sellling goods or services to a company - with charities or other non-profit organisations, if you are in that sort of role you seek to be reimbursed for costs you've incurred, not make a 900% profit on it!

Well yes expenses then, that's just splitting hairs, would the charity have paid full price if he didn't have discounted fares, appears so!...I just dont think its as big a deal as some of the other MP rorts of recent times.

B.M.
18-08-2010, 11:10 AM
The guy’s a straight thief and should be Publically Flogged.

He quite deliberately took from the charities he was supposed to represent to feather his own nest. i.e. He charged them for a cost he didn’t incur.

Unfortunately, this type of thing is all too common amongst charities. In a lot of cases the amount taken out of donations in the name of “Overheads” is obscene.

All power to the arm of Internal Affairs or whoever it is tipping these thieves out. :clap

mikebartnz
18-08-2010, 11:17 AM
So he did not rip off the charities.
He ripped of the government ie us !
No he ripped off the charities because he would have got the MP's discount regardless.

PaulD
18-08-2010, 03:10 PM
No he ripped off the charities because he would have got the MP's discount regardless.

The ex MP travel is not for business travel only private, it's not as if he was volunteering his time he was being paid by the charities.

KarameaDave
18-08-2010, 04:29 PM
The man is nothing but a common criminal, as all National Party Anuses are :p

somebody
18-08-2010, 07:17 PM
Well yes expenses then, that's just splitting hairs, would the charity have paid full price if he didn't have discounted fares, appears so!...I just dont think its as big a deal as some of the other MP rorts of recent times.

If he had paid full price, then there would have been no problem, since he'd be legitimately claiming an expense for something he paid full price for.